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snowcat · Mar 25, 2008

Hi,

I have a large digger bucket to overhaul this week,
50ton machine, with the large buckets theres always issues with cracking, The problem is theres 3 different hardness materials to cope with LCMS sides, Hardox toe plate and high point carbon teeth brackets, Hardox recommend Hi lo Rods and preheat, cracking still tends to occur particularly teeth to toe butt fillets, any advice on this please, BTW the smaller machines bellow 15tons never have issues...

shenion · Mar 25, 2008

I thought that was what doing 2 passes with 60xx and 70xx rods was for. The softer 60xx helps relieve stress on the outer.

Although, I have also read on on another forum to use a 7018 root and a 6013 cap pass. The idea is that the outer portion of the weld flexes more so the more ductile 60xx works while the 7018 provides strength.

snowcat · Mar 25, 2008

hmmmm this is how iv welded them in the past lo, hi root, with a 5mm 6013 cap, or even caped with the MIG however these big buckets seem to stress crack sideways, A few Iv seen look like theyve been welded Inox.., Its a real problem as the buckets take so much stress.

Drains · Mar 25, 2008

A nice soft buttering rod, then something a wee bit harder over the top....

Oh, I don't know what i'm talking about.

Technic Al?... or phone JCB/Case/Hitachi etc and ask them?

Tell you what Snowy, i'd be straight onto UK Welder with this one. Sod the smart arses, there's enough good lads over there to give you the answer. Oh, and change the thread title to "digger bucket welding", or summat.

snowcat · Mar 25, 2008

simondrains said:
Technic Al?... or phone JCB/Case/Hitachi etc and ask them?

Yer, hoping Al will be along with a few ideas, I spoke to the guys who make or import

the edges but offered the standard lo hi answer.....

I dont know takes a while for em to crack, but it bugs me they do..... as I said some of the teeth look inox welded, but surely thats not the job, dunno :confused:

yep I think Il do the UK welder and maybe stick a post up on weldingweb, good few on there that are into that sort of thing.............

TechnicAl · Mar 26, 2008

I would go for either a 309L or a 312. The 312 will be more expensive but it would be the best choice, its stronger. If you use either there is no need to preheat and the weld will work harden to around 500Hv so depending on which Hardox it may be similar.

If the weld is too big (say over 25mm thick) dont use 312 all the way through. You can get it too hot and this will make it brittle. If you need to put in a lot of weld start with 312, allow it to cool, use 308L as the fill, allow it to cool between runs, and then cap off with the 312.

Done loads of buckets like this and it works (famous last words)

DIY Welding · Mar 26, 2008

A 307 type electrode would be best, this rod has a high cracking resistance, you can get this in mig or mma and would be more cost effective than 312 also 307 will work harden

TechnicAl · Mar 26, 2008

yes ,307 is another way, as is 308Mo but really they are both similar to 309. Just another way of doing the same thing.
The 312 weld metal has higher strength and that will help resist the battering taken by most digger buckets.

Drains · Mar 26, 2008

I see you've got an argument going on over on UKW, Snowy. Well done that man.

Some good answers though. Here too (I notice I was right about the buttering electrodes - 309's. I do have a bit of a clue then! Makes a change.)

Also the Hardox download sort of says it all. Handy.

snowcat · Mar 26, 2008

Yes si, Iv just added some fuel to the fire, but because I'm pre post moderated, chances are it will post at some point tommorow........

Yep I pulled the Hardox stuff off last night, but wanted some "real life" opinions now iv got em a plenty

Really Its a choice between 2 routes wouldn't ye say??

I haven't even posted on WW yet, there proper volotile... :laughing:

BTW thanks Al, and DIY.....

weldequip · Mar 26, 2008

Got the 312's off the shelf if you decide on that route Snowcat

weldequip

snowcat · Mar 26, 2008

Ohhh I let you know what UKW, decide once the dusters are off, I'm getting slaged now for not providing enough info, tho the pre moderation of all my posts means it takes hours to try and reply and fill in the gaps... :mad:

weldequip · Mar 26, 2008

What's with this "pre-moderation"? :rolleyes:

weldequip

snowcat · Mar 26, 2008

weldequip said:
What's with this "pre-moderation"?
weldequip

The very heavy handed approach of UKW I'm afraid, under x amount of post's or till you can prove you a good lad, every things pre moderated

, Problem is when you trying to add replies to a technical post, Its impossible because they can take 12 hours to post......Its a very heavy handed approach thats got its residents mad, as whole threads can suddenly disappear for little reason.....Its a shame because many of the members have a large technical knowledge and something like this question has thrown up some great answers, that a DIY forum such of this would be unlikely too,...but without some loosening of the rains the moderators on there might find themselves a tad lonely....

Drains · Mar 26, 2008

Send an email to the UKW moderators and ask them to un-moderate you. Tell them what you do for a living, and they will ease off a little.

snowcat · Mar 26, 2008

Chears Si

snowcat · Mar 26, 2008

weldequip said:
Got the 312's off the shelf if you decide on that route Snowcat
weldequip

Well after all that its the 312 route overwise its gona mean changeing all the holders, PM me a price Ta.....

dutchman · Mar 27, 2008

Hi Snowcat,

You have received a lot of advice already, but just wanted to add that if you have any more questions about the digger bucket and welding it, I can ask a mate who has worked with diggers for almost 40 years. He is not a welding specialist, but he knows his way around with stick has welded his buckets.

Drains · Mar 28, 2008

Snowy, I enjoyed muchly the debate over on UKW, as did many others it would seem. Well asked!

I see you're now unmoderated too, so you can join in the un-necessary slagging of the opinionated/foolhardy/ignorant etc.

Si

snowcat · Mar 28, 2008

simondrains said:
Snowy, I enjoyed muchly the debate over on UKW, as did many others it would seem. Well asked!

I see you're now unmoderated too, so you can join in the un-necessary slagging of the opinionated/foolhardy/ignorant etc.

Si

Oh I, now i know 312 everthing that a site welder might come and replace in the future :laughing:

F***** it Im 312,ing everthing together in future and blameing it on Al

..

Eye, think it proved I was opinionated/foolhardy/ignorant enouth to become a fully paid member of the UKW, look forward to some bashing, I feal that anti DIY welder chip growing as we speek.....

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