Another Fobco Star Bench Drill

[hotponyshoes]

Just posting this here so I have some sort of reference in a years time when I find all the bits for this in a box but I will probably have some questions as well!

I was looking for a half decent bench mounted pillar drill for home use.
This is only for my own little projects, mostly one-offs.
Local stockists had the generic Sealey/Draper types in stock but for just under the same price as a new one of those I picked up this pretty old lump of English iron.


I initially thought the guy was dreaming about the asking price but after doing a bit of research and seeing the amount of interest others were showing in it I don't think it will lose me any money over the next few years!

As far as I can tell it has only ever been used on wood and on the lowest speed setting. There is one peck mark on the outer edge of the table but no other damage that I can see.
All the chrome handles are flaking but all working freely aside from the main feed handle. The feed itself is fine but the flaking chrome stops you adjusting the handle position freely.

The most obvious thing I have noticed is the plate on the drill shows this one was originally a 3-phase 1420rpm motor. From doing a quick bit of reading up i believe that would have been 1/2 HP.
It is currently fitted with a single-phase AEI 1425rpm 1/3 HP motor.
That's good news for me as A: I don't have 3ph. And B: I think I have another identical motor somewhere as a spare!

The other obvious thing is that it is green. My brief research says they were all cream. The inside of the belt housing on this one is cream and there are signs of cream coming through in places under the green paint. Looking at the name plates and paint finish I would be pretty convinced that the cream was a primer and the green is a factory finish. Either that or somebody has done a very painstaking refurb/repaint of this at some stage?
I am not sure if the white handle knobs are original as all the photos I have seen show round black ones?
It starts and runs very smoothly. I have not gauged it up yet but at full travel I can not feel any play at all. Compared to the slop on a new £400 Sealey I am happy I have made a good choice!

Now the questions:
Chuck is a #34. I believe this might well be the original. I was expecting a morse taper drift hole but there is not. How do I get the chuck off?

It did not come with a chuck key. I found a nice quality (new, old stock) chuck key that fits the chuck perfectly. When reading up I found that there is a cast lug to hold the key when not in use. Disappointed to find the bar on my chuck key is too big to fit the holder. I have bought another new key, this one fits the holder ok but is not such a nice fit in the chuck. Is it ok to drill out the lug a bit? Or is that considered sacrilege on a machine like this?

There is a casting with number "71" fixed to the drill with a hammer-drive screw. I can't find any reference to this anywhere. What is it?

There is an independent collar on the shaft between the head and the table. What's that for?

I will probably have more questions later on!



I am not really sure what to do with it at the moment. I am toying with the idea of finding an original 3phase motor and running it from a variable speed vfd but I think 1/3 hp at 1k rpm will probably be all I really need from it anyway.

I did buy it to use it not as a project but now I have felt the weight of it and the quality I am tempted to give it a bit of love. As much as I would like to have all the handles re-chromed and polish the whole thing up I am tempted to put it to use and maybe leave the restoration until I need to replace a bearing or something in the future.
I might replace the main handle with a bit of new bar and some round knobs and keep the original somewhere safe for now...

 

[Rannsachair]

I have a Fobco star too, great little drill.
I would just drill out the chuck key storage hole - who will notice.
To get the chuck off see: https://www.model-engineer.co.uk/fo...the nut from the,see the chuck removal collar.
The collar above the table I use when lowering the drill head, I lock it where i want to move it down to and it is easier than holding the weight of the drill head as I clamp it.

 

[Arc Tourist]

Nice find. Golf balls make great comfortable handle's for chuck keys and files. Consider adding one to your chuck key, as it will give you more purchase power when tightening a bit.
If you decide to try this, just make sure when drilling a ball that you wear eye protection, because some brands of balls have a liquid core under pressure. A ball on a chuck key will also make it easier to find.

 

[hotponyshoes]

I am still young enough to refuse to have anything to do with golf.

I will either spend the money on a pair of new ones, or spend an excessive amount of money on drilling and tapping some stainless steel ones or maybe just try the existing ones first and see what they are like!

 

[cheb]

To me the collar is there to stop the head from falling if you need to rotate it on the column. The 71 might be a works ID number, one of my pillar drills had something similar with Fort Dunlop written on it.

Ball ends are easily available pre drilled from Ebay and the like.

 

[Seadog]

As said, the 71 tag is a factory asset or position number. To lower the head wind the chuck down onto a piece of wood, lock the quill, reposition and clamp the collar, then use the handle to control descent as you undo the quill lock.

You can work out how to raise it, I'm sure.

 

[cheb]

Do you use a scissor jack?

 

[Seadog]

Nope. A slight re-ordering of the process to lower the head

 

[minimutly]

Film on tv last night featuring Maureen lipman - 40 years ago? About two Jewish kids who left Manchester (or Bolton or somewhere like that) as evacuees during the blitz. It showed a clothing factory of sorts where she was working - there in the background - a fobco star, original cream colour. Sure they weren't about in 1940 though?

 

[Rannsachair]

Film on tv last night featuring Maureen lipman - 40 years ago? About two Jewish kids who left Manchester (or Bolton or somewhere like that) as evacuees during the blitz. It showed a clothing factory of sorts where she was working - there in the background - a fobco star, original cream colour. Sure they weren't about in 1940 though?

Started up in 1946, so not quite right.

 

[Red'n'Black]

Just posting this here so I have some sort of reference in a years time when I find all the bits for this in a box but I will probably have some questions as well!

I was looking for a half decent bench mounted pillar drill for home use.
This is only for my own little projects, mostly one-offs.
Local stockists had the generic Sealey/Draper types in stock but for just under the same price as a new one of those I picked up this pretty old lump of English iron.
View attachment 251099

I initially thought the guy was dreaming about the asking price but after doing a bit of research and seeing the amount of interest others were showing in it I don't think it will lose me any money over the next few years!

As far as I can tell it has only ever been used on wood and on the lowest speed setting. There is one peck mark on the outer edge of the table but no other damage that I can see.
All the chrome handles are flaking but all working freely aside from the main feed handle. The feed itself is fine but the flaking chrome stops you adjusting the handle position freely.

The most obvious thing I have noticed is the plate on the drill shows this one was originally a 3-phase 1420rpm motor. From doing a quick bit of reading up i believe that would have been 1/2 HP.
It is currently fitted with a single-phase AEI 1425rpm 1/3 HP motor.
That's good news for me as A: I don't have 3ph. And B: I think I have another identical motor somewhere as a spare!

The other obvious thing is that it is green. My brief research says they were all cream. The inside of the belt housing on this one is cream and there are signs of cream coming through in places under the green paint. Looking at the name plates and paint finish I would be pretty convinced that the cream was a primer and the green is a factory finish. Either that or somebody has done a very painstaking refurb/repaint of this at some stage?
I am not sure if the white handle knobs are original as all the photos I have seen show round black ones?
It starts and runs very smoothly. I have not gauged it up yet but at full travel I can not feel any play at all. Compared to the slop on a new £400 Sealey I am happy I have made a good choice!

Now the questions:
Chuck is a #34. I believe this might well be the original. I was expecting a morse taper drift hole but there is not. How do I get the chuck off?

It did not come with a chuck key. I found a nice quality (new, old stock) chuck key that fits the chuck perfectly. When reading up I found that there is a cast lug to hold the key when not in use. Disappointed to find the bar on my chuck key is too big to fit the holder. I have bought another new key, this one fits the holder ok but is not such a nice fit in the chuck. Is it ok to drill out the lug a bit? Or is that considered sacrilege on a machine like this?

There is a casting with number "71" fixed to the drill with a hammer-drive screw. I can't find any reference to this anywhere. What is it?

There is an independent collar on the shaft between the head and the table. What's that for?

I will probably have more questions later on!

View attachment 251105

I am not really sure what to do with it at the moment. I am toying with the idea of finding an original 3phase motor and running it from a variable speed vfd but I think 1/3 hp at 1k rpm will probably be all I really need from it anyway.

I did buy it to use it not as a project but now I have felt the weight of it and the quality I am tempted to give it a bit of love. As much as I would like to have all the handles re-chromed and polish the whole thing up I am tempted to put it to use and maybe leave the restoration until I need to replace a bearing or something in the future.
I might replace the main handle with a bit of new bar and some round knobs and keep the original somewhere safe for now...

I have one, great little machines. Mine has the original cream paint, I thought they were all like this?

Mine was fifty quid on eBay in just-about-running condition. I fixed the worst of the bodges and then just used it, it could really do with some TLC and the spindle bearings sorting out.

I got mine ten years ago, at the time there were still some original parts available from Tony at lathes.co.uk, he sold me a chuck, table clamp and a few other bits, plus a manual. Not sure if there will be any left by now but give him a try, very helpful bloke.

 

[hotponyshoes]

Everything I have read points to them all being cream.
It's more than possible this one has been repainted but somebody has certainly spent a lot of time and effort doing it if it has?

 

[nutgone]

At the risk of hijacking this thread I’m after some advice from the seasoned fobco drill restorers here. Well, more confirmation than advice really.
Yes, I’ve got one of these wonderful machines, I’ve even been using it for light milling duties with the help of a compound table, it’s worked well. But it kept tripping the breaker every so often, so I thought it was time for a quick rebuild. I think I’ve sorted the motor (if not I’m going down the 3ph with vfd route in the future, especially as this one only has a 1/3hp motor).
Mine also seems to have an odd quill spindle, it’s got a MT1 socket up inside the spindle, not on an extended nose, this isn’t listed on lathes.co website, so I’m guessing it’s been adapted. I’ll add pics if I can.
Anyway, my main problem is the spindle bearings inside the quill. Mine aren’t angular contact, they’ve obviously been replaced at some point with regular deep groove ball bearings. I’ve bought a new pair of angular contact ones, sized against the ones already fitted. I just need some confirmation for the reassembly process.
After some research I’ve discovered these bearings are usually fitted in a back-to-back arrangement in usual machine spindle practice, is this correct?
If so then I’m assuming the preload is done by loading against the inner races of both bearings? I can do this on my hydraulic press with some carefully machines tube (obviously with just light pressure, more as a place to hold it really), but how much pressure? I’m guessing it’s more of a feel thing?

I’m pretty sure mine was originally 3ph, it now has a (very old) Metropolitan Vickers motor in it, on soft mounts. The whole thing looks like someone threw a bucket of dirty white paint at it, the original cream is still inside though.
Sadly I don’t have the time to do the full restoration, so it’ll have to stay in “working clothes” for now, just mechanical & electrical issues seen to.

it was milling fine, but set up a slight wobble when I attempted plunging an 8mm end mill into 10mm aluminium flat stock, then the breaker blew for the final time & I decided to sort it. I’m an ex-electrician & engineer(of sorts) anyway, so no excuses really.
Pics added of original (shielded) bearing (the big one was the only one with a number) the new bearings & some of the quill & spindle arrangement.

 

[hotponyshoes]

I'm sure I read that the mt chuck mount was available from the factory. Either as an option or as a variation.
Probably read it via one of the links above or possibly the latches.co.uk site?

 

[Agroshield]

Try here for info on the bearing question: https://www.model-engineer.co.uk/forums/postings.asp?th=104962

 

[nutgone]

Try here for info on the bearing question: https://www.model-engineer.co.uk/forums/postings.asp?th=104962

Thanks, I just found that one in my research. That’s answered my questions.

 

[nutgone]

I'm sure I read that the mt chuck mount was available from the factory. Either as an option or as a variation.
Probably read it via one of the links above or possibly the latches.co.uk site?

Lathes.co.uk only states an MT1 on the extended nose version, but it does look very factory done, so it could well be original. The bearings definitely weren’t though I’m surprised it did milling work as well as it did.
I only wish it had been MT2, then it could’ve shared tooling with my lathe tailstock.

I’ll get it back together tomorrow (I need daylight to use my press).
Almost all of the restoration threads on these are the earlier type with the Jacob’s taper quill & the 2 small bearings. Hopefully someone can make some use of my findings.