Cabling for SIP Stick Welder

[paulmitchell1984]

Hi guys

iv been given an old SIP Stick welder which is a heavy beast, iv used it before and got some good result but the cables could do with being replaced.

I fancy some longer ones so i dont have to carry it about much but wondered should i get thicker cable if im going further distance, currently about 1.5m long and would like to potentially double that on each cable.

thanks in advance

Oh and if any body knows anywhere local to Leeds for the cable give us a shout

 

[Kent]

the problem is heavier cables weigh more! - longer cables are a pain as regards their heft anyhow. Running out heavy long welding cables from a tangled mass can be like fighting with a greased anaconda! You might well find its out of the frying pan into the fire. The insulation is also quite prone to cracking on welding leads and it can get a costly thing to keep changing them so if the run is long consider this with care before you jump.

 

[rtbcomp]

It shouldn't be too difficult to make a cable-tidy out of an old wheel rim.

It wouldn't do any harm to go to a thicker cable, get cable with loads of thinner strands of copper rather than fewer thicker ones for flexibility. I'm sure welding equipment suppliers (Yellow Pages) will stock it and be able to advise you on size, they'll need to know the maximum current output of your welder.

 

[brightspark]

just tell us the amperage of your welder and we can tell u what size cable to get . 3 meters in length isnt going to make any diffrence in voltage drop with a bit of decent rubber coated copper cable

 

[Turbo]

You could get a set of lighter cables 3m long and also get a set of heavier extension cables and join them with dinse connectors when you need them. You can probably get away with just extending the electrode lead, saving you money.

 

[phill d]

Get the 13mm cables with hundreds of strands and a nice rubber outer coating.
expensive yes, need to replace no. these will last you out and will let as much current through as youl ever need.
DO NOT get cables that are stiff, they will be useless, need very flexible cables or wont be worth having.

cost is the only problem, unless you know somewhere getting rid of fork lift charging cables !!!!!!!!!!!

phill

 

[paulmitchell1984]

thanks for the info guys, the welder is a sip 140, so assume 140 amp?

 

[phill d]

the first link above is ok, but the second is no good as not enough single strands and would be too stiff to move around easy.
you need to have very supple cable of will be forever getting mad with it.

might be worth looking out for a broken big welder for spares and use the cable from that !!!
often see broke welders that are cheap enough just purely for the cables. and get good quality too.

just a thought.




phill

 

[phill d]

no its not.
you don't have cable bound into bigger cable into bigger.
what he needs is all separate wires exactly what boat cables and forklift battery charging cables are made off, its much better than that
advertised and much more supple to move around.
As soon as cable gets bundled it starts to get stiffer and will not bundle up as good neither.
It will also lose more current due to heat dissipation than separate strands in a rubber outer not plastic.

just go check out the prices of the proper stuff. never mind whats advertised, get the right stuff and job will be fine.
Same with good jump leads, they need to be separate strands not bundled to get the amps through quick.


phill

 

[brightspark]

[QUOTE="phill d, post:
Same with good jump leads, they need to be separate strands not bundled to get the amps through quick.


phill[/QUOTE]sorey for laughing it doesnt matter how the core is configured its the cross sectional aeria of the cable and how many amps it will carry. it dont get there any quicker.it just turns current in to heat if there not large enough and u get voltage drop and looses power to the appliance

 

[phill d]

Here its explained easier than i could think of.


Number of strands
The more individual wire strands in a wire bundle, the more flexible, kink-resistant, break-resistant, and stronger the wire is. But more strands increase cost.

The lowest number of strands usually seen is 7: one in the middle, 6 surrounding it. The next level up is 19, which is another layer of 12 strands on top of the 7. After that the number varies, but 37 and 49 are common, then in the 70 to 100 range (the number is no longer exact). Even larger numbers than that are typically found only in very large cables.

For application where the wire moves, 19 is the lowest that should be used (7 should only be used in applications where the wire is placed and then does not move), and 49 is much better. For applications with constant repeated movement, such as assembly robots and headphone wires, 70 to 100 is mandatory.

For applications that need even more flexibility (welding is the usual example, but also any need to move wire in tight areas), even more strands are used. One example is a 2/0 wire made from 5,292 strands of #36 gauge wire. The strands are organized by first creating a bundle of 7 strands. Then 7 of these bundles are put together into super bundles. Finally 108 super bundles are used to make the final cable. Each group of wires is wound in a helix so that when the wire is flexed, the part of a bundle that is stretched moves around the helix to a part that is compressed to allow the wire to have less stress.




well it looks like I was correct again brightspark. .......

I think mr fuzzy was talking about this now I read it again, if so then yes I agree, but the wire advertised is not like that, its just 7 stranded.


phill

 

[the snooper]

Phill - Rollox, its the same cable just a bigger CSA, the strands are bound into bundles, bound into bigger bundles. That IS the correct cable.... *head meet desk*

no its not.
you don't have cable bound into bigger cable into bigger.
what he needs is all separate wires exactly what boat cables and forklift battery charging cables are made off, its much better than that
advertised and much more supple to move around.
As soon as cable gets bundled it starts to get stiffer and will not bundle up as good neither.
It will also lose more current due to heat dissipation than separate strands in a rubber outer not plastic.

just go check out the prices of the proper stuff. never mind whats advertised, get the right stuff and job will be fine.
Same with good jump leads, they need to be separate strands not bundled to get the amps through quick.


phill

Here its explained easier than i could think of.


Number of strands
The strands are organized by first creating a bundle of 7 strands. Then 7 of these bundles are put together into super bundles. Finally 108 super bundles are used to make the final cable.



well it looks like I was correct again brightspark. ....... phill

or not, brightspark said, it doesnt matter how the core is configured its the cross sectional area of the cable and how many amps it will carry he was refaring to the current aspect not how flexible it would be, you also said
It will also lose more current due to heat dissipation than separate strands in a rubber outer not plastic. but brightspark pointed out that's not the case which is correct, if you have a cable with 100 strands making up a cross sectional area of 1cm it will carry the same amperage as a cable with 10 strands making up the same cross sectional area of 1cm and as long as its going to carry the correct amperage neither should produce heat

 

[brightspark]

Here its explained easier than i could think of.


Number of strands
The more individual wire strands in a wire bundle, the more flexible, kink-resistant, break-resistant, and stronger the wire is. But more strands increase cost.

The lowest number of strands usually seen is 7: one in the middle, 6 surrounding it. The next level up is 19, which is another layer of 12 strands on top of the 7. After that the number varies, but 37 and 49 are common, then in the 70 to 100 range (the number is no longer exact). Even larger numbers than that are typically found only in very large cables.

For application where the wire moves, 19 is the lowest that should be used (7 should only be used in applications where the wire is placed and then does not move), and 49 is much better. For applications with constant repeated movement, such as assembly robots and headphone wires, 70 to 100 is mandatory.

For applications that need even more flexibility (welding is the usual example, but also any need to move wire in tight areas), even more strands are used. One example is a 2/0 wire made from 5,292 strands of #36 gauge wire. The strands are organized by first creating a bundle of 7 strands. Then 7 of these bundles are put together into super bundles. Finally 108 super bundles are used to make the final cable. Each group of wires is wound in a helix so that when the wire is flexed, the part of a bundle that is stretched moves around the helix to a part that is compressed to allow the wire to have less stress.




well it looks like I was correct again brightspark. .......

I think mr fuzzy was talking about this now I read it again, if so then yes I agree, but the wire advertised is not like that, its just 7 stranded.


phill

what the hells that got to do with cable current carrying capacity. irespective of how many strands or in what configuration its the cross sectional aeria of the cable that matters to how much load it can carry jeesus i couldnt care less if u can do figure of 8 with it i havent mentioned flexibility

 

[norlander]

Oi think the arrnser loies in the coil.

 

[phill d]

Its.going to be very hard educatimg the thick..

I will try to find a janet & john version
To maybe help you read up on cable structure and how it carries current.

 

[the snooper]

Its.going to be very hard educatimg the thick..

I will try to find a janet & john version
To maybe help you read up on cable structure and how it carries current.

So now you are telling a fully qualified spark (bright spark ) he is wrong and thick ? You have a serious attitude problem, when you first appeared on the forum you didn't even know how to strip and clean a simple drill motor, and threw your toys out of the pram and spat your dummy when things went slightly off topic as you needed help yet at every opportunity you tell people they are wrong as for your answers they are all from google
take your posts from above

mr fuzzy the strands are bound into bundles, bound into bigger bundles
phill d no its not. you don't have cable bound into bigger cable into bigger

then here comes the final best bit of all your last google find

phill d number of strands, The strands are organized by first creating a bundle of 7 strands. Then 7 of these bundles are put together into super bundles. Finally 108 super bundles are used to make the final cable.

so you contradicted your self, if you are only here to troll and wind people up you wont last very long, weve seen people just like you come and go.

 

[Wozzaaah]

Its.going to be very hard educatimg the thick..

I will try to find a janet & john version
To maybe help you read up on cable structure and how it carries current.

You seem to be enjoying winding people up so you're now excluded from replying to this thread.
I don't know what forums you're used to but we like it nice and friendly on here.
Keep up with the insults and it will earn you some time in the sin bin, you have been warned.

 

[normspanners]

or not, brightspark said, it doesnt matter how the core is configured its the cross sectional area of the cable and how many amps it will carry he was refaring to the current aspect not how flexible it would be, you also said
It will also lose more current due to heat dissipation than separate strands in a rubber outer not plastic. but brightspark pointed out that's not the case which is correct, if you have a cable with 100 strands making up a cross sectional area of 1cm it will carry the same amperage as a cable with 10 strands making up the same cross sectional area of 1cm and as long as its going to carry the correct amperage neither should produce heat

I agree to all that and those thoughts came to mind as I read it.

WOOPH

Its.going to be very hard educatimg the thick..

I will try to find a janet & john version
To maybe help you read up on cable structure and how it carries current.

So now you are telling a fully qualified spark (bright spark ) he is wrong and thick ? You have a serious attitude problem, when you first appeared on the forum you didn't even know how to strip and clean a simple drill motor, and threw your toys out of the pram and spat your dummy when things went slightly off topic as you needed help yet at every opportunity you tell people they are wrong as for your answers they are all from google
take your posts from above

mr fuzzy the strands are bound into bundles, bound into bigger bundles
phill d no its not. you don't have cable bound into bigger cable into bigger

then here comes the final best bit of all your last google find

phill d number of strands, The strands are organized by first creating a bundle of 7 strands. Then 7 of these bundles are put together into super bundles. Finally 108 super bundles are used to make the final cable.

so you contradicted your self, if you are only here to troll and wind people up you wont last very long, weve seen people just like you come and go.

I think you are targeting Phil------- Mr Snooper#, after all I think we need more people like him (phil) who are outspoken rude and obnoxious, it will help the forum no end, to have people like Phil, to help us join the LEVELS of other, waste of words--- chat s**t shows, called forums.



My view is :-) Well said that Wozzaaah
PS# I was jesting mr Snooper----- because this did need addressing

 

[normspanners]

Get the 13mm cables with hundreds of strands and a nice rubber outer coating.

I have never heard of 13mm cable ??
16 / 25 and 35mm that is what I am used to ???