whensparksfly
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how do you all get a straw coloured steel tig weld I want to hear your views on this topic.
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mr migwire
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i personaly use straw coloured paint , also has the added bonus of stopping welds going rusty,,, 
sorry could't resist....
sorry could't resist....
whensparksfly
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Could you explain your method
Shox Dr
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1.6mm Tungsten ground to a needle
No6 cup. (Type of lens makes no difference.)
5lpm
35amps. No slope, etc
Method for the corner, is to strike arc on one side and quickly more to the other,forming two pools one on either sheet, so long as they are touching the two pools will stick together, once that has happened, it's just a case of chasing the keyhole, with a 1.2mm rod in your hand just in case.
For the overlap, arc up on bottom sheet, as soon as you have a pool, move the tungsten on to the lap sheet, as if you were writing italic letter j backwards, washing the pool formed on that sheet into the bottom sheet. The material; 316 SS 0.9mm
No6 cup. (Type of lens makes no difference.)
5lpm
35amps. No slope, etc
Method for the corner, is to strike arc on one side and quickly more to the other,forming two pools one on either sheet, so long as they are touching the two pools will stick together, once that has happened, it's just a case of chasing the keyhole, with a 1.2mm rod in your hand just in case.
For the overlap, arc up on bottom sheet, as soon as you have a pool, move the tungsten on to the lap sheet, as if you were writing italic letter j backwards, washing the pool formed on that sheet into the bottom sheet. The material; 316 SS 0.9mm
langy
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Steel ???
whensparksfly
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langy is right it was steel I was talking about not stainless
mark williams
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keep the tungsten near the shroud, not sticking out too far, big cup for plenty of shielding and don't travel to fast, the pool behind you needs to cool while still covered by the shielding gas.
I don't get the obsession with weld colour personally, much of what is written on the interweb about it is utter nonsense. Especially if it's spouted by someone showing off their partial penetration welds on some stainless exhaust part that will be covered in surface oxides the moment the engine is run in anger. Soooooo many things can have an effect on weld colour it's virtually meaningless with regards to weld quality for example it's easier to get "good" (or even no) colour on thicker material than it is on thin stuff. If you're welding near an edge then there's nowhere for the heat to 'run too' for example
That's a fan from an air cooled VW, they're slotted together origionally with two little tabs on the ends of the fins which are then peened over which is fine until you start upping the rev limit hence welding 'em and rebalancing the fan. Don't ask me what the settings were but gas flow would've been around 4 - 5 L/min through a #7 gas lens and i wouldn't have been pausing for the post flow. The changes in heat tint kinda tells the order i welded in
If the part is stainless and corrosion resistance is paramount then even "good" colours need removing after fabrication hence pickling & passivation. If it's Ti then you need to go whatever lengths necessary to prevent colours beyond straw forming in the first place hence giant gas lenses, trailing purges etc.
This is 25 x 3mm ERW mild steel done the other day so i remember it was about 110A, #7 gas lens with plenty of stickout to make it easy to see what i was doing. Again would've been around 4 or 5 l/min. No solvents/degreasing, just knocked off the scale with a clean & strip disc when i was cutting everything to length
If it'd been an outside corner the colours wouldv'e been darker not that it matters as it'll soon be rust coloured if it isn't painted...
That's a fan from an air cooled VW, they're slotted together origionally with two little tabs on the ends of the fins which are then peened over which is fine until you start upping the rev limit hence welding 'em and rebalancing the fan. Don't ask me what the settings were but gas flow would've been around 4 - 5 L/min through a #7 gas lens and i wouldn't have been pausing for the post flow. The changes in heat tint kinda tells the order i welded in
If the part is stainless and corrosion resistance is paramount then even "good" colours need removing after fabrication hence pickling & passivation. If it's Ti then you need to go whatever lengths necessary to prevent colours beyond straw forming in the first place hence giant gas lenses, trailing purges etc.
This is 25 x 3mm ERW mild steel done the other day so i remember it was about 110A, #7 gas lens with plenty of stickout to make it easy to see what i was doing. Again would've been around 4 or 5 l/min. No solvents/degreasing, just knocked off the scale with a clean & strip disc when i was cutting everything to length
If it'd been an outside corner the colours wouldv'e been darker not that it matters as it'll soon be rust coloured if it isn't painted...
whensparksfly
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are you welding that box section at a slow speed?
Not really* although i wasn't rushing either. Length of the weld is another reason why it came out golden/straw... if it'd been 50 x 50 x 3 box the weld would've probably been darker (mostly blues probably) because while a #7 cup isn't exactly big most of the weld along one side of 25mm box stays under the cup even when you wrap the corners- i stopped short at the right of the pic and the weld along that face i purposely left underfilled as stuff is to be welded onto that corner later
If it'd been 1.5mm wall there'd be more heat tinting in general and the weld would've been darker despite welding at 60ish amps instead of the 110 i was using. Less mass to the part = the heat travels further.
* Don't get me wrong, i'm not knocking the guy as he's waaaaay neater than i'll ever be but watch how sloooooowly he's welding and how he keeps turning the part so the weld is always right in front of him
Some of the reasons why i'll never be that neat are probably down to hand steadiness but mostly it's down to patience. I weld stainless a chunk faster than that and aluminium a LOT faster. I want to finish, get paid and go to the pub, not post pictures of pretty welds on faceache
If it'd been 1.5mm wall there'd be more heat tinting in general and the weld would've been darker despite welding at 60ish amps instead of the 110 i was using. Less mass to the part = the heat travels further.
* Don't get me wrong, i'm not knocking the guy as he's waaaaay neater than i'll ever be but watch how sloooooowly he's welding and how he keeps turning the part so the weld is always right in front of him
Some of the reasons why i'll never be that neat are probably down to hand steadiness but mostly it's down to patience. I weld stainless a chunk faster than that and aluminium a LOT faster. I want to finish, get paid and go to the pub, not post pictures of pretty welds on faceache
langy
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whensparksfly
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because someone else can do it
Richard.
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Your Tig welding must be absolutely perfect if your trying to concentrate on pretty colours.
The colour of the weld on stainless is not important due to the fact it will be cleaned in most cases, it's even less important with steel because as said above its either gonna rust or be painted.
The colour of the weld on stainless is not important due to the fact it will be cleaned in most cases, it's even less important with steel because as said above its either gonna rust or be painted.
whensparksfly
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I know your right I just want to know how everyone gets this colour.
^^ This. If the juice and travel speed are properly balanced and the arc length is nice and tight the "good colour" thing will happen by itself a lot of the time. Moreso on inside corners that kinda trap argon and thicker material which has a greater heat sink effect.
Make weld colour a top priority and it's very easy to either end up producing pretty little welds with incomplete penetration and/or lack of fusion problems or getting sucked into the mentality of using giant gas lenses all the time and working reeeaaaaaly slowly because you weld an inch, stop and wait for the post flow to ensure you keep the "colour". Reposition the part so it's right in front you and your hand rest and repeat. With this method you really need a faceache account to show off all the pretty welds that'll be lost under oxidation the moment the engine is run in anger
Skip to 1.50 for the bit i'm talking about. Again not really knocking the guy as i'll never have the patience to be that neat for similar types of work. Be interesting to see what he can do grovelling around on the floor with say a pipe butt stuffed tight against a wall or contorted into a pretzel shape inside a funny car cage with bits of cage jabbing him in the ribs
Another way is using pulse to keep the average heat input down without compromising elsewhere. Still using a large cup not that there's anything wrong with that as you don't need to flow massive quantities of argon through 'em and the turntable is obviously a big advantage when the weld is circular but another exhaust part welded by someone at proper working speeds without any BS...
Make weld colour a top priority and it's very easy to either end up producing pretty little welds with incomplete penetration and/or lack of fusion problems or getting sucked into the mentality of using giant gas lenses all the time and working reeeaaaaaly slowly because you weld an inch, stop and wait for the post flow to ensure you keep the "colour". Reposition the part so it's right in front you and your hand rest and repeat. With this method you really need a faceache account to show off all the pretty welds that'll be lost under oxidation the moment the engine is run in anger
Skip to 1.50 for the bit i'm talking about. Again not really knocking the guy as i'll never have the patience to be that neat for similar types of work. Be interesting to see what he can do grovelling around on the floor with say a pipe butt stuffed tight against a wall or contorted into a pretzel shape inside a funny car cage with bits of cage jabbing him in the ribs
Another way is using pulse to keep the average heat input down without compromising elsewhere. Still using a large cup not that there's anything wrong with that as you don't need to flow massive quantities of argon through 'em and the turntable is obviously a big advantage when the weld is circular but another exhaust part welded by someone at proper working speeds without any BS...
never quite understood these motorsport welders.
i've only ever made 1 manifold that i've put serious effort into trying to make the welds look fandango - it's the only one that ever broke
every other manifold i'd say they were good welds but the rippels are never exactly even and it's whatever colour. some mates go on about the HAZ , putting stress into it and all that, my argument is its made in a quater of the time and the whole thing is HAZ shortly after the rotary silencer joins the party for the 1st time
i've only ever made 1 manifold that i've put serious effort into trying to make the welds look fandango - it's the only one that ever broke
every other manifold i'd say they were good welds but the rippels are never exactly even and it's whatever colour. some mates go on about the HAZ , putting stress into it and all that, my argument is its made in a quater of the time and the whole thing is HAZ shortly after the rotary silencer joins the party for the 1st time
norlander
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I think the appearance of the welds is now something demanded by the customer for motorsport welding jobs, so its becoming the norm. There is thread about walking the cup, some are for it some against it, but one of the blokes says that some outfits require you to do it-others don't-but if you want to broaden your options in that field, I suppose you would have to get to grips with it.
The way I look at it-as a outsider with very limited TIG experience- the requirement for immaculate beads and pretty colours has arrived on the scene in the same manner as BS did in the army.
The saying was, "BS starts in the ranks" and it did, one soldier works out how to bull up his boots to a ridiculous gleaming shine,ossifer sees it and next thing, sergeant-major is checking everybody is doing it on the mornng parade.
So the blokes in that unit have no choice but to knuckle down and do it and curse the bloke who started it.
And everybody knows full well, supershiny boots might look smart, but they make no efficiency contribution in a bayonet charge.
