inconsistent welding

[NotSure]

Hi all,

I am having a problem with my welds being consistent.

Basically i am trying to spot weld on 1mm sheet body panels with 0.6m wire.

I have set up the welder on a off cut of the repair panel and i get really nice welds with the correct penetration and a good sound.

I then go to the car and put down a couple of welds, fine no problem. But every so often for no reason i will start to weld a spot weld and it starts to pop and fart. The wire just shoots back to the tip of the welder and sometimes welds itself to the end of the welder.

I have found that if i keep the welder going through this popping stage after a second or two it will run fine and weld a nice spot weld, But not always.

I have tried cleaning the panels again with a wire wheel and sometimes it helps but not always. I have also tried to wipe the panels before welding with white spirit to try removing any grease or oils but again inconsistence with the spot welds.

I’m getting really disheartened with the welding at the moment and am getting really hacked off with not being able to resolve this problem.

Any help would be much appreciated.

Chris

 

[mike 109444]

Are you spotting on a VERY good piece of metal (original car side) with a VERY good new bit of metal (new piece going in) Reason if where you are trying to spot has rust ect on the UNDERSIDE then as the spot brakes through (penetrates) it may draw into the weld pool some of the rust or crap (paint) in to the pool. I know that it is sometimes difficult to get to the other side (hence spotting). Could you maybe have the torch hose slightly bent when at the car causing poor feed but when at the bench with your test piece the torch hose is nice and straight?

 

[BrokenBiker]

as above but also check if your contact tip is tight and in good condition. I had a similar problem and found there was spatter inside the bore of the tip causing the wire to drag and arc out inside the tip itself. New tip sorted it for me

 

[J.B. Welding]

All Good Above, Also sometimes if you twist the torch hose the wire can spin as it feed out again, does it happen when you change position? And make sure the earth doesn't fizz when you weld (look out of side of helmet)! keep trying!!

 

[NotSure]

Thanks for the replies guys.

I understand welding onto the original metal of the car could draw rust into the poop but it is also doing it on the practice sheets (off cut of repair panel) which is cleaned on both sides. I also ensure that when welding the torch lead it straight and kink free or if bend it has a long smooth curve.

Today i went over as advised took the tip apart and cleaned any spatter off and ensured everything was tight and secured. I then took the repair panel and cleaned both sides with the wire wheel and had another go at running a few spot welds to get some pictures.

i welded this sheet flat on the work bench. I ran each weld for 1 sec then left 2 seconds before the next weld running left to right.



and the reverse of the panel



The first (left) on both rows started popping along with the 4th on the second row.

 

[mfletch]

Is the 0.6 wire clean no rust just a little rust plays havoc with welds

 

[J.B. Welding]

Try running the weld to the edge of the pool rarther than ending in the center each time.

 

[mike 109444]

Looking at the "failed" ones there looks to be very little power going in and there is no sign of heat build up, From what you have tried so far I would say you MAY have a poor wire feed that is intermittently failing to get up to speed OR a poor connection that is reducing the power getting to the weld. You could look at the ground clamp,
check the jaws of the clamp are clean
check the wire clamp on it is not loose
check the connection on the machine end (does it have a dinzel plug?)
Not sure what your electrical knowledge is like, if ok then you could (with mains plug removed from socket!) check through the connections inside the machine including on the power selector switches.
What machine is it ??

 

[J.B. Welding]

I just read your problem again and if its still happening I recon it can only be wire feed or gas problem. The roller on the wire feeder has a groove for each wire size is it the right groove for 0.6 and look sweet? listen to your reg. and torch for gas issues, you may be getting near the breakdown current for 0.6 and its running the wire up to the tip..
("when you think about it sounds complicated")

 

[norlander]

last time I did any mig was years ago, but what you described turned out to be a bad earth when it happened to me.

 

[NotSure]

Thanks for the replies.

I will defiantly have a look into the electrical connections.

The welder is a butters 195R. It is defiantly running the 0.6 motor wheel as i remember distinctly checking it when i put the new real in.

I have had a problem with the motor slipping the wire but i have cleaned and tightened the tensioner on the motor and the wire feeds through fine whist not welding and has a consistent feed even whilst adjusting the feed rate.

However (may be a stupid question) But whilst welding does the act of welding put any force on the wire? I.E. does it become harder for the motor to push the wire into the weld pool over just holding the torch on the air and pressing the button?

My welder has a "fixed" torch handle to the lead/ sheath (unsure of the name of the cable from the welder to the torch handle). I know a lot of more expensive welders have a euro torch. if there any advantage to these if it is possible for me to change my set up?

I do find the trigger switch is very stiff and not at all responsive. You have to really squeeze to get the wire to start to feed but the gas comes through with very little pressure. I have had a look at the switch set up but there is nothing i can do to improve this so iv just put up with it.

 

[mike 109444]

Thanks for the replies.

I will defiantly have a look into the electrical connections.

The welder is a butters 195R. It is defiantly running the 0.6 motor wheel as i remember distinctly checking it when i put the new real in.

I have had a problem with the motor slipping the wire but i have cleaned and tightened the tensioner on the motor and the wire feeds through fine whist not welding and has a consistent feed even whilst adjusting the feed rate.

However (may be a stupid question) But whilst welding does the act of welding put any force on the wire? I.E. does it become harder for the motor to push the wire into the weld pool over just holding the torch on the air and pressing the button?

My welder has a "fixed" torch handle to the lead/ sheath (unsure of the name of the cable from the welder to the torch handle). I know a lot of more expensive welders have a euro torch. if there any advantage to these if it is possible for me to change my set up?

I do find the trigger switch is very stiff and not at all responsive. You have to really squeeze to get the wire to start to feed but the gas comes through with very little pressure. I have had a look at the switch set up but there is nothing i can do to improve this so iv just put up with it.

It is possible to OVER tighten the pressure roller!
IT should not put extra force on the wire BUT some welder take there feed for the wire feed motor from the same source as the welding voltage so when the arc is struck the voltage to the feed motor may dip.
You tourch sound much like the Clerk or SIP type with the gas valve in the handle. A new replacement can be quite dear (look in the Weldwquip shop at top of page, under Clerk torches) A kit to replace it for a euro torch may be much cheaper as they seam to have come down in price.
Might be worth looking at the mod done on SIP welders to see if any apply to your welder ie wire feed brace and such like

 

[NotSure]

Thanks for the reply.

I have had ago with the tension of the pressure roller but i am still having issues with the welder and after tying to weld this afternoon it is begining to get worse.

I am having the welder taken into a welding shop tomorrow for them to have a look at it for me. If it is a expensive issue i will look to replace it with a better model.

Thanks.