Lorch M6060 rescue

[Shedendman]

I got a phone call this afternoon asking do i want this old welder that was part of a house/garage clearance i thought yer go on,what is it

Well this is what i ended up with


looks like it had a hard life at some time


Took the side panels off to snoop inside




Seems to me this was set up for 240v research tells me it can be 3 phase also

As you can see inside theres a fair amount of dust dirt and cobwebs thats gathered over the years the resident spider ran off before i could get a snap of him
More to follow

 

[Shedendman]

So 1st things 1st,connected up some power to it


Hummm,one has power and the fans working
I took the bottom selecter switch off as it was jammed it,looks like it was kicked etc
So,heres where the fun starts,fitted my torch to see if the wire motor would run squeezed the trigger and POP it tripped the main leccy circuit tried again and same thing,BUT,on the 2nd time i did notice a flash coming from the following component



Now the top of this seems to be like a push down button sort of thing,the 3rd time i put the power on i pressed this and the same thing happened as with the torch,it just tripped the main leccy(MCB) which i will ad is on the 32amp main ring
Ok 1st few questions
What is this component called?
Whats it function?
Whats the chances of me getting a replacement?
Or is there something else thats causing it to trip
Can i warn you i'm not anywhere near leccy savvey so please decribe stuff to me like you would to your mum,actually your mum might get it better than me

Thanks guys

 

[Pete.]

Looks like a simple contactor to me. Think of it as a giant relay, it has a coil inside that you put a small current through which then magnetically pulls in the main contacts (or you can manually close it by pressing on the top). If it's flashing and popping the breaker, that just means that whatever it's feeding power to is drawing a large current. The fault is down-stream of this device.

 

[Shedendman]

@Pete.
Ok i get that thanks, so,where would you advise i look next?

I'm going to try and further take it apart tomorrow suck some of the dust up etc get a good look inside

 

[mike 109444]

Looks like the main transformer MAY be cooked (see yellow circle)
If you label then carefully disconnect the connections above (X's) on the enamel (copper coloured cable side) and pull the 8 wires out of the strip connector, this will isolate the main transformer from the rest of the circuit (the secondary of transformer + diode pack and capacitors). If you now connect power and pull trigger you may find the feed motor + gas valve should work as they get there feed (I think) from the smaller transformer (that also feed the fan) If that works then we can go from there.

 

[zzr1200]

My next port of call would be a pm to matt with the model/serial number of the machine and ask for any info available and if you think the transformer is goosed maybe ask if a replacement one is available/price possibly?

Also it might be wise to be sitting down when you read the price.

 

[Welderpaul]

Bin!

 

[rtbcomp]

"POP it tripped the main leccy circuit" MCB or RCD ?

 

[Shedendman]

"POP it tripped the main leccy circuit" MCB or RCD ?

MCB

 

[Shedendman]

Bin!

Be no loss if i have to,got it for nothing,but its worth a try

 

[dobbslc]

You can disconnect that transformer after marking up the connections and test it for shorts to earth.
Test between the outputs and the metal core and the separate coils, it should be giving a high resistance, if you get any continuity it's knackered.

 

[Shedendman]

Looks like the main transformer MAY be cooked (see yellow circle)
If you label then carefully disconnect the connections above (X's) on the enamel (copper coloured cable side) and pull the 8 wires out of the strip connector, this will isolate the main transformer from the rest of the circuit (the secondary of transformer + diode pack and capacitors). If you now connect power and pull trigger you may find the feed motor + gas valve should work as they get there feed (I think) from the smaller transformer (that also feed the fan) If that works then we can go from there.

@mike 109444
Right i followed what you said and it DIDNT, trip out this time,BUT,the motor didnt spin nor did the gas valve click in


I have supplied 12v dc to the motor and it worked so i know that works
I'll try what @dobbslc said and take it from there
Thanks chaps

 

[mike 109444]

Think you will find that you WILL get a low reading measuring across those disconnected winding's as they ARE just a length of copper wire so would expect to see a low reading!
I would have RE-connected those winding's and then disconnect the output which will go to the diodes/capacitor bank. Remember when you pull the trigger those capacitors will TRY to charge up, putting a lager load on to the supply (caps behave as a short to AC until charged.). IF with secondary disconnected it powers up and triggering does not trip supply THEN reconnect secondary and disconnect the caps (but leave the diodes connected) Then you will be able to check it's not one or more diodes shorted. If that does not trip THEN could be one or more of the caps BUT you need to take MORE care checking them out.

 

[Shedendman]

Guys really appreciate your help,but i think @Welderpaul hit the nail on the head with BIN, i've decided not to fight a lost cause so just taken the bits i need ie motor euro connection gas valve few switches oh and the rubber matting on top,might glue a bit of that on top of my oxford, plus weigh in the copper
Thanks for your help chaps

 

[Pete.]

Someone might one day make use of the diode pack, but I think you made the right decision there let it die a dignified death

 

[matt1978]

I had a quick look on the online service archive, which is where I can find user manuals etc for the existing and former models of machines, but the earliest dated machines I could see begun in 1991 and that model wasn't listed. You machine still has "Made in West Germany", so it must be prior to 1989. I think Crawley welding used to sell Lorch products around the mid 80's. If you had the serial number I could find out exactly but if its scrap then there is little point.

 

[Rig Pig]

Guys really appreciate your help,but i think @Welderpaul hit the nail on the head with BIN, i've decided not to fight a lost cause so just taken the bits i need ie motor euro connection gas valve few switches oh and the rubber matting on top,might glue a bit of that on top of my oxford, plus weigh in the copper
Thanks for your help chaps

Don't be too hasty to bin it, is it wired correctly for 240v if you are trying to run it up configured 415v it will pull a hell of a current.

 

[Shedendman]

I had a quick look on the online service archive, which is where I can find user manuals etc for the existing and former models of machines, but the earliest dated machines I could see begun in 1991 and that model wasn't listed. You machine still has "Made in West Germany", so it must be prior to 1989. I think Crawley welding used to sell Lorch products around the mid 80's. If you had the serial number I could find out exactly but if its scrap then there is little point.

Thanks Matt but yep sadly its off to be a few tins of beans

 

[bwservices]

you should have kept this

I have one in for repair,they are fairly easy to troubleshoot
on first glance mine needs a power switch,contactor,and pot,but it will still be a viable repair being single phase/all copper/200amps

 

[Shedendman]

you should have kept this

I have one in for repair,they are fairly easy to troubleshoot
on first glance mine needs a power switch,contactor,and pot,but it will still be a viable repair being single phase/all copper/200amps

Where was ya 2 years ago then