lorch resonant inverter micor Stick

[Sarto]

Hi to all.
Could someone explain in few, easy word how a "resonant inverter" works?
I was yesterday in a fair near me, and I saw the welders from Lorch in action.

Reading in the catalog, I see that the small stick welder Micor stick 160 uses a
resonant inverter. Hence the question.

Thanks to all,

SARTo

 

[Robotstar5]

Probably one for Matt1978?

 

[HughF]

A quick google of 'resonant inverter design' brings up plenty of pdf's... You good with electronics?

 

[Sarto]

No. That's why I asked it in easy word.

 

[HughF]

The inductance of the load presents a resonance in the output circuit of the smps. Tune the switching frequency and timing to the resonance of the load and you increase switching efficiency... I think that's the general idea from a quick skim read.

 

[pedrobedro]

The inductance of the load presents a resonance in the output circuit of the smps. Tune the switching frequency and timing to the resonance of the load and you increase switching efficiency... I think that's the general idea from a quick skim read.

You made me feel stupid not realising it was that simple in the first place. Did you hear that whoosh noise, that was it going right over my head

 

[Kent]

Hi to all.
Could someone explain in few, easy word how a "resonant inverter" works?
I was yesterday in a fair near me, and I saw the welders from Lorch in action.

Reading in the catalog, I see that the small stick welder Micor stick 160 uses a
resonant inverter. Hence the question.

Thanks to all,

SARTo

It's done by a witch I think? other than that I don't know

 

[matt1978]

Easiest way to simplify it is that conventional inverter design means that it will be designed to switch at a given frequency. Generally speaking the higher the frequency the smaller the machine inverter can be (as it requires a much smaller transformer) when conventional inverters are designed they may be very good at one process but no so great on another, this, in part is down to the design and the switching frequency.

Important to note is that whatever frequency the inverter is designed to switch at is fixed. It cannot be changed. It's totally fixed.

micor resonant inverters are able to vary the switching frequency, this means that the inverter can actively increase or decrease its switching speed depending on the local conditions. Mains input fluctuations, long cable lengths, difficult electrodes etc etc. It can create a huge voltage reserve and introduce this extra voltage into the welding circuit to keep optimum welding results as and when required.

 

[Kent]

Even I can understand that and most importantly I can see a tangible benefit to it in use
Sounds like someone was forgetting his " and this means to you.,,,,,,,,"

 

[Sarto]

Is it the same thing you can find in the welder equipped with PFC?
Often you can read PFC helps with "Mains input fluctuations, long cable lengths".

 

[HughF]

Nope, pfc is on the input rectification side of the inverter design.

 

[eSCHEn]

Easiest way to simplify it is that conventional inverter design means that it will be designed to switch at a given frequency. Generally speaking the higher the frequency the smaller the machine inverter can be (as it requires a much smaller transformer) when conventional inverters are designed they may be very good at one process but no so great on another, this, in part is down to the design and the switching frequency.

Important to note is that whatever frequency the inverter is designed to switch at is fixed. It cannot be changed. It's totally fixed.

micor resonant inverters are able to vary the switching frequency, this means that the inverter can actively increase or decrease its switching speed depending on the local conditions. Mains input fluctuations, long cable lengths, difficult electrodes etc etc. It can create a huge voltage reserve and introduce this extra voltage into the welding circuit to keep optimum welding results as and when required.

So is it doing some kind of PWM Matt?

Appreciate that you may be under NDA for this stuff so understand if you can't speak about it

 

[Kent]

Now I am no electronics guy but nda? Surely a rival could buy one and find out? Then it's registered designs and pattents that should protect?

 

[Robotstar5]

Now I am no electronics guy but nda? Surely a rival could buy one and find out? Then it's registered designs and pattents that should protect?

I should imagine a verbal or written explanation could save a lot of time and money needed for reverse engineering?

 

[HughF]

Reverse engineering modern electronics from just a pcb, good luck with that...

Some resonant inverter stuff:

http://www.infineon.com/dgdl/Applic...n.pdf?fileId=db3a30433a047ba0013a4a60e3be64a1

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resonant_inverter

 

[eSCHEn]

Reverse engineering modern electronics from just a pcb, good luck with that...

Some resonant inverter stuff:

http://www.infineon.com/dgdl/Applic...n.pdf?fileId=db3a30433a047ba0013a4a60e3be64a1

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resonant_inverter

Thanks Hugh, I made it about a third in before it got too obtuse for me Good reading though.

 

[matt1978]

I don't understand the whys and wherefore behind it all as I'm not electrically minded.

The guy who developed our patented system is also the electronics engineer who designed Fronius' patented system. The TransPocket 1500 was his baby.

I just know that the main difference is that it has less hardware and more software so less parts and as I said before the ability to vary it's switching frequency to give optimum results whatever the local conditions.

 

[Kent]

I don't understand the whys and wherefore behind it all as I'm not electrically minded.

The guy who developed our patented system is also the electronics engineer who designed Fronius' patented system. The TransPocket 1500 was his baby.

I just know that the main difference is that it has less hardware and more software so less parts and as I said before the ability to vary it's switching frequency to give optimum results whatever the local conditions.

Will report back on my new Micor because changing conditions power wise I certainly have