My first weld, what can i do better

[b1rken]

Hey everyone. Got my Esab LKA 180 working, had some wire feeding problems. Still got an reel/roll of wire thats to small so I have to hold my hand on it to brake it while welding from time to time. But unless that its now perfect. Borrowed a bottle of co2/argon secure 18/mison 18 and tried some mig welds for the first time.

1mm galvanized steel or what its called. I thought i got rid of all the galvanization, but there was alot of white poudery stuff around my welds so i guess i didnt get it away :\

Used 2-3 on power settings, max is 7.
And 3-4 / 10 on feeding

 

[zardoz]

Thats ok for a first go. Try running longer welds, its while you are doing that you get time to see the actual weld pool. Its from recognising whats happening in the molten metal pool that you start to learn. Try different settings and see how it affects it.

 

[b1rken]

Bougt some 0.7mm bodywork plate's today, which i dont have to grind off all the galvanisation. Also filled up a 20l bottle of Secure 18 welding gas, and bought a reel of 5kg welding wire.

Here i tried to lay some welds.

Front:

Back:

My welder:

Im using 10l/min of gas.

On these welds i was changing between 4-5 (1-10) on the wire speed.
The power setting was on 4 (1-7).
Using 6mm welding wire.

I tried to weld at power setting 3, and adjusting the wire feed from lowest and up while welding but i couldnt get a nice arc. What can that be? Tried cleaning the earth clamp, but didnt help.

When i have it at 4 i get a nice sounding arc, but i have to tune it down on the wire feed to control the heat/burntrough.

Any tips?

 

[malcolm]

I'm surprised the power was on a middle setting for 0.7mm sheet. Generally the lowest setting is the way forward.

The welds do have far too much penetration. Try a butt joint on that setting and you'll blow a hole. The one second from right looks like it would transfer to a butt weld OK.

Can't see any other issues in the photos in your second post. But I suspect you are running too fast and too hot and that's why you have spatter, but the welds them self look steady and consistent.

Try a butt joint. 0.7mm might be a complete pain to start with - if it's troublesome try 1.5mm - you'd have no trouble with that.

 

[welding is my gift]

yer for your first go thats actually not bad but you dont want to go thicker metal when i learned to stick weld i used 0.8 mild steel and when you get that down the thick stuff is easy

 

[b1rken]

Hehe thats what im thinking aswell. Its thin metal im gonna be welding, rust repair on and old veteran.

But running to hot and fast you say. When i turn the power knob down to 3 the wire is just knocking/hacking on the steel if i turn the wire speed up. And if i turn it down it looks like the wire just burns back.

Looked in a manual for the LKA 180 welder that i have and it says:

For 0.8mm steel, with 0.6mm wire, i should have 4.5 on the wire feed and 4 on the power setting.

And those settings are about the same i use. Only that i turn down the feeding abit because it seems like i get more control over the weld then.

The manual also say that if i were welding the same 0.8 sheet with 0.8mm wire i should have 3 on the power and 3 on the feeding.

So i guess the settings are right?

What else could it be? Could it be that im moving to slow, or holding the torch in an wrong angle? All the welds on the picture i have been dragging the gun, not pulling it forwards.

 

[malcolm]

It ought to be possible to find a nice middle point between too fast and too slow on an ESAB like that.

How far is the torch from the steel? Should be about 5mm from the tip to the metal. Torch should be only 10 or 20 degrees from vertical when working on the flat. Or are the tip and wire liner in good condition?

Having a look at the internet, one advert for that welder suggests it can go down to as low as 10 amps, so maybe setting 2 or 3 for power would be good for 0.8mm sheet.

 

[b1rken]

The tip is about 6mm from the workpiece when im welding, but i have the torch in around 45 deggree angle. Liner and tip is brand spanking new.

Ill try to go down to 2 and see. But i dont think it`ll make a difference. When i weld on 3 its like im only laying a stripe of ketchup over the sheet im welding.

I will try to holding the torch closer and in an higher angle. And ill also check the thickness of the steel plate i got, got a little unsure yesterday when i tried to bend it

Here is a table with welding thickness,wire, speed and current for my welder.

 

[malcolm]

The chart will be an initial guide, but the settings will be up to the individual. I'd be inclined to slow down a bit and weave the torch a bit - similar to this page: http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/learning-mig.htm

The weave helps you control speed, but the major advantage is when joining 2 sheets together. If you go in a straight line it's easy to penetrate into one sheet but not the other - a wiggle ensures you penetrate both.

 

[b1rken]

Ah ok. Yes today i've praticed a little bit more. Tried cutting off some pieces and welding them back with that wave pattern.


I also tried experimenting with lower current/poweer, but its just not working. When i have the welder power setting on 3 the welding burns back, and if i turn it up it crashes in the piece im welding and there is a hell of alot splatter.

I also tried with power set at 2, but then i was just laying thick welds on the top of the sheet metal, and still the arc seems funny

As soon as i turn it up to 4 its great. I turned the feeding down around 3,25 and tried to seam weld in that wave pattern.

Front

Back

I guess the two welds to the right are the best? Took a picture of them alone

Front

Back

The backside looks different than the welds i welded on a whole sheet, but for what i know it looks like they penetrated all the way. The welds are not higher on the backside like before, and the welds look nicer from the frontside aswell.

On these welds i was keeping the torch closer and more in a 20 degree angle?

I also measured the thickness of the sheet metal, and its between 0.7 to 0.8 mm thick.

Am i on the right track, and does those two welds look ok? Still up for tips to make them better

 

[malcolm]

They look very controlled, but still too much penetration. The ideal for bodywork would be to ensure there is always some penetration (so you can't see the edges of the reverse sheet) but not quite as much as you have.

I think we're talking at cross purposes on power settings. Personally I'd reduce the voltage setting from where you are now (the knob with 7 positions). That will reduce penetration, but you might well need to re-tune the wire speed to find a new sweet spot once you've done that.

Purists will claim that wire speed controls amps (which it does and it's really useful), but only within a small range of speeds at eavh voltage. Too high will batter against the metal until you increase the voltage, and too low will burn back until you reduce the voltage. So set voltage first and then fiddle with the wire speed to suit.

 

[b1rken]

Hmm, ok. But thats it what i've done when i've been welding with the power setting at 3. I set it at 3, and the feeding at the lowest. Then i start to weld, and slowly increase the wire feed. First it burns back, then it starts crashing in the sheet metal, and there is alot of splatter. No way near the same thing that happends in the video shown on the turorial about setting wire speed. But when i have it at 4 its just like the video in the tutorial.

Maybe i can try to make a short movie tomorrow when im welding at power setting 3 and turning the feeding from 1-10 slowly. I wont get a good picture but you could hear the sound.

Btw, the welds look higher on the on the backside on the photos than they do in real life. Ill try to take a photo of it from the side if that helps.

 

[malcolm]

I notice the recommended settings on the welder don't mention 0.6mm wire for welding really thin stuff, but does mention 0.8mm. I wonder if the welder has weird characteristics which lead to the difficulty in finding a sweet spot.

Do you have any 0.8mm wire to try? See if it's any nicer on the lower settings.

Just a guess - others on here will know much more about possible welder weirdness than me.

 

[b1rken]

Hehe i noticed that myself. I think ive read somewhere that you cant weld thinner material than the thickness of the welding wire you are using.

Unfortunatetly i havent got any 0.8mm wire to test. But i can see if i cant borrow a reel someday. I bought 0.6mm wire because i was going to weld on my car, and thought that would be best.

I think to remember that when i was welding with the 0.9mm flux core wire i was using 3 on the power setting. But im not sure.

Anyhow, the penetration on my last weld is that "very" too much penetration? I could try to go a bit faster with the torch.

 

[simmo]

mate

everybody cheats where they can
but don't do it by laying a bead, waiting for it to expand, then moving slightly along and waiting for it to expand also

cheat by pushing the shroud against the workpeice with a short electrode length in one smooth very slow motion, with the wire speed set to a very slow setting. when I say pushing the shroud I mean very very slow. like 5mm per second

cheers mate, and good luck!! better then my first effort
-simmo

 

[Wizard of Arc]

mate

everybody cheats where they can
but don't do it by laying a bead, waiting for it to expand, then moving slightly along and waiting for it to expand also

cheat by pushing the shroud against the workpeice with a short electrode length in one smooth very slow motion, with the wire speed set to a very slow setting. when I say pushing the shroud I mean very very slow. like 5mm per second

cheers mate, and good luck!! better then my first effort
-simmo

What is the shroud?

Thanks.

 

[Wozzaaah]

The shroud is the (usually) chrome plated nozzle on the end of the mig torch.