Pillar drill not very smooth, rebuild?

[GraemeVW]

I have a kerry super 8, got it maybe 8 years ago. I just stripped, cleaned and painted it than put it back together. It's been in use since but it's not very smooth.
I've decided I should do something about it, but not really sure what the issue is.

The quill is a good fit in the body. Doesn't seem to be much play. Without the drill running it's smooth lowering and raising the quill.

The bearings feel and sound good. Start it running and it seems great.

But, the two together, lowering the quill with the motor running you can hear it being very notch and you can feel the notch sound in the handle. It's like you can now feel the rack on the quill and it feels like it's lowering in steps.

I'm going to take it apart again, see if anything obvious stands out. I may put new bearings in it, but they seem fine.
Do the symptoms ring any bells for anyone that's rebuild drills before?

Once it's smooth I think I really need to find a new chuck too.
Any recommendations for something up to 13mm which is reasonably cheap? Keyed is fine.
Not had any luck with used Jacobs.

 

[MattF]

I've ordered several of these, & had no problems. They seem quite good for the money. B16 taper.

1.5-13mm Clamp Range Bearing Steel Keyed Drill Chuck B16 Taper Mounted w Key | eBay

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[GraemeVW]

I've ordered several of these, & had no problems. They seem quite good for the money. B16 taper.

1.5-13mm Clamp Range Bearing Steel Keyed Drill Chuck B16 Taper Mounted w Key | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for 1.5-13mm Clamp Range Bearing Steel Keyed Drill Chuck B16 Taper Mounted w Key at the best online prices at eBay! Free delivery for many products.

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Cheap enough too.
I don't have a b16 about so just looked for those too. Didn't realise arbours were so cheap!
If I'd known that I wouldn't have put so much time into removing the bloody things in the past!

 

[GraemeVW]

Had a thought with the drill, if the drive rotation is trying to rotate the quill a little, the quill rack will start to bind a bit on the handle pinion.
That sounds like it would cause what I'm feeling.

 

[6ply]

What size do you want?

 

[GraemeVW]

What size do you want?

View attachment 392100

Quite the collection!
Mt2 in the quill and a 1.5mm, or 1mm, to 13mm chuck.
It has a Jacob's 34 iirc at the moment and It would be perfect if it didn't have so much run out.

On a seperate note, what taper do belco chucks use? I have a massive one on a mt1 about that came with my lathe. It fits the tailstock but it's way too big and heavy for a mt1.
I did toy with using that in the drill but it doesn't close down small enough for what I need.

 

[GraemeVW]

Had a thought with the drill, if the drive rotation is trying to rotate the quill a little, the quill rack will start to bind a bit on the handle pinion.
That sounds like it would cause what I'm feeling.

Thinking about this some more...
I can't remember what stopped the quill from rotating. I assume it has a vertical slot and a key in the drill body?
I wonder if the slot is worn so the quill is rotating a little and making the quill rack to pinion clearance too tight.

 

[6ply]

Quite the collection!
Mt2 in the quill and a 1.5mm, or 1mm, to 13mm chuck.
It has a Jacob's 34 iirc at the moment and It would be perfect if it didn't have so much run out.

On a seperate note, what taper do belco chucks use? I have a massive one on a mt1 about that came with my lathe. It fits the tailstock but it's way too big and heavy for a mt1.
I did toy with using that in the drill but it doesn't close down small enough for what I need.

Not much choice of mt2. I have better chucks in mt3. I could check runout if interested? To compare.

 

[GraemeVW]

Not much choice of mt2. I have better chucks in mt3. I could check runout if interested? To compare.
View attachment 392106

If you get chance, yes, checking run out would be great.
Mine doesn't have a HUGE amount, but enough to make drilling 2mm holes interesting.

I was staying away from used chucks as I've always had issues, but then I've not bought one from someone willing to check the thing first!
Thanks

 

[Agroshield]

But, the two together, lowering the quill with the motor running you can hear it being very notch and you can feel the notch sound in the handle.

Is there a splined projection at the top of the spindle, above the top bearing in the quill, that moves through splines in the drive pulley? That bit is quite slender and if there is run out (due to a slight bend) in that part, it can have odd effects.

Does it have reverse? Is the same issue present when rotating anti-clockwise?

 

[GraemeVW]

Is there a splined projection at the top of the spindle, above the top bearing in the quill, that moves through splines in the drive pulley? That bit is quite slender and if there is run out (due to a slight bend) in that part, it can have odd effects.

Does it have reverse? Is the same issue present when rotating anti-clockwise?

It does slide through the top pulley yes. I hadn't considered that, I'll check that too and spindle straightness when it's apart.
No reverse, just backgear.

 

[6ply]

If you get chance, yes, checking run out would be great.
Mine doesn't have a HUGE amount, but enough to make drilling 2mm holes interesting.

I was staying away from used chucks as I've always had issues, but then I've not bought one from someone willing to check the thing first!
Thanks

I measured run out on 4 drill chucks fitted to my pillar drill. The tests were not rigorous but may give you an idea of what to expect. All measurements taking using a dial indicator on the same 10mm ground stock held in each chuck. Measurement taken about 25mm from the jaws.

My everyday keyed Jacobs chuck about 0.2 mm
Probably a Chinese chuck, definitely on a Chinese arbor, about 0.3 mm
An old Jacobs, about 0.4 mm
A very beaten up looking Rohm Supra keyless chuck, MT1, to which I whacked on an MT1 to MT2 adapter for this test, 0.03 mm Erm... well that was a surprise result.

 

[GraemeVW]

I measured run out on 4 drill chucks fitted to my pillar drill. The tests were not rigorous but may give you an idea of what to expect. All measurements taking using a dial indicator on the same 10mm ground stock held in each chuck. Measurement taken about 25mm from the jaws.

My everyday keyed Jacobs chuck about 0.2 mm
Probably a Chinese chuck, definitely on a Chinese arbor, about 0.3 mm
An old Jacobs, about 0.4 mm
A very beaten up looking Rohm Supra keyless chuck, MT1, to which I whacked on an MT1 to MT2 adapter for this test, 0.03 mm Erm... well that was a surprise result.

That is a surprise!
I'll measure mine too, see how it compares.
How much run out would you say is to be expected normally?

Is the Rohm the only good one, or is the Rohm a freak?
I assumed run out should be hundredths rather than tenths!

 

[6ply]

That is a surprise!
I'll measure mine too, see how it compares.
How much run out would you say is to be expected normally?

Is the Rohm the only good one, or is the Rohm a freak?
I assumed run out should be hundredths rather than tenths!

I think the run out recorded with the Rohm was luck, but they are generally regarded a good name. Or they were. I bet I wouldn't get the same reading next time.
I've never bothered with the run out on a pillar drill, so long as it's not obviously excessive. Most times I'm drilling and tapping 5mm to 12mm, or similar imperial sizes.

 

[RichardM]

A very beaten up looking Rohm Supra keyless chuck, MT1, to which I whacked on an MT1 to MT2 adapter for this test, 0.03 mm Erm... well that was a surprise result.

I have a Rohm Supra (0-8mm), made before the wall came down, it is accurate.

 

[GraemeVW]

Im not overly fussed avout run out, but it has enough to deflect small drills sometimes.
I think I'll rebuild the drill, sort the quill issue, then measure to see exactly what's going on. Maybe I can improve the Jacobs I already have.

 

[MetalMonkey]

Im not overly fussed avout run out, but it has enough to deflect small drills sometimes.
I think I'll rebuild the drill, sort the quill issue, then measure to see exactly what's going on. Maybe I can improve the Jacobs I already have.

If you do, please do start a thread and take some pictures - I've got to get around to taking mine apart for a refurb at some point and it would be interesting to see how it all comes apart.

 

[GraemeVW]

If you do, please do start a thread and take some pictures - I've got to get around to taking mine apart for a refurb at some point and it would be interesting to see how it all comes apart.

I will. I've had it apart before, seem to remember it wasn't too hard. Apart from getting the spindle out of the quill.

 

[skippy75]

Did you ever find out what caused this issue? It sounds identical to my Fobco star problem.