what is the fitting or taper of my chuck ?

[phill d]

Hi folks.
I have a Elliott Progress No1 drill press, the chuck is a Jacobs no34 .
today I took it off for the very first time while doing a complete makeover on the drill.
it came off pretty easy using the knurled nut to release chuck and a wedge that I cobbled up.
I was expecting to see a bit of metal coming out the chuck, but instead of that the chuck has
a taper inside it ????
Obviously my quill has a taper on the end of it, but what exactly is the size of this ?
or how do I measure it ?

and what is this type called, would like to know proper name as feel a pillock not knowing the
correct term for this.



phill

 

[graffian]

Hi folks.
I have a Elliott Progress No1 drill press, the chuck is a Jacobs no34 .
today I took it off for the very first time while doing a complete makeover on the drill.
it came off pretty easy using the knurled nut to release chuck and a wedge that I cobbled up.
I was expecting to see a bit of metal coming out the chuck, but instead of that the chuck has
a taper inside it ????
Obviously my quill has a taper on the end of it, but what exactly is the size of this ?
or how do I measure it ?

and what is this type called, would like to know proper name as feel a pillock not knowing the
correct term for this.



phill

It's most likely a jacobs taper and the chuck will probably have the taper stamped on it,
all my jacobs chucks do. But I have never had a spindle with a taper[male taper].
The chucks I have are mostly JT2 or 3, thought it's years since I looked I may be
wrong. So look for a JTx number on the chuck or stick jacobs taper dimensions into
google and you bound to find the specs.

 

[phill d]

there is nothing on the chuck like that.
ill look on Google, good idea.
definitely the spindle is tapered, I did have the chuck off to take the quill stop off to clean that up properly and check bearings etc.

cheers

phill

 

[Richardjjj]

Hi Phil.
Attached link gives the different taper references and sizes.
http://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/projects/Info/chuck-dimensions.html.
May help.

Richard

 

[piman]

Hello Phill,

surely the morse taper shaft is still in the quill, three inches or so from the end should be a slot so you can insert a taper drift to eject it?

Alec

 

[brightspark]

my drill hasnt a morse taper in the shaft it only has a jacobs taper machined on to the end of the shaft .the size and model are stamped on the chuckhttp://www.jacobschuck.com/

 

[rtbcomp]

Hello Phill,

surely the morse taper shaft is still in the quill, three inches or so from the end should be a slot so you can insert a taper drift to eject it?

Alec

My progress No2 has this, but it looks like the No1 has the setup BS describes.

 

[phill d]

yep mine is like brightspark says, taper on end of quill shaft.
my chuck does not say anything other than Jacobs no34 made in Sheffield and the 0 - 1/2 in and 1 013mm. that's it nothing else.

the drills ive seen with a slot in the quill to hold a bar while turning the nut with another tommy bar have less table to chuck height and have a quill
that is obviously not as strong. maybe that's why they have smaller tables and smaller table collar to allow for this .

 

[graffian]

my drill hasnt a morse taper in the shaft it only has a jacobs taper machined on to the end of the shaft .the size and model are stamped on the chuckhttp://www.jacobschuck.com/

I just had a look and I have a few yank Jacobs chucks that are marked and the others aren't.
It was just luck the two I replaced the mandrels are marked.

 

[Wendelspanswick]

the drills ive seen with a slot in the quill to hold a bar while turning the nut with another tommy bar have less table to chuck height and have a quill
that is obviously not as strong. maybe that's why they have smaller tables and smaller table collar to allow for this .

I don't think strength has anything to do with it, as you don't sideload the quill, its for cost purposes. Its alot easier, and so cheaper, to machine a Jacobs taper on the end of a shaft then it is to machine an internal Morse taper and an extraction slot on the end of that same shaft.

You used to be able to 'spec' your new drill, either having just a Jacobs taper on the end or having a more expensive internal Morse taper.

I am not saying this was an option on your drill but it certainly was on certain models of the Pollard Corona drills.

The advantages of a Morse taper is you can mount other tooling in the quill of your drill like tapping heads and boring bars as well as the fact that a Morse taper drill bit won't slip as a plain shank drill can do in a Jacobs chuck.

 

[brightspark]

[QUOTE="Wendelspanswick, post: 614746, member:
The advantages of a Morse taper is you can mount other tooling in the quill of your drill like tapping heads and boring bars as well as the fact that a Morse taper drill bit won't slip as a plain shank drill can do in a Jacobs chuck.[/QUOTE]thats providing u dont mind buying a set of taper shank drill bits .there only realy needed drilling anything over half inch

 

[Wendelspanswick]

[QUOTE="Wendelspanswick, post: 614746, member:
The advantages of a Morse taper is you can mount other tooling in the quill of your drill like tapping heads and boring bars as well as the fact that a Morse taper drill bit won't slip as a plain shank drill can do in a Jacobs chuck.

thats providing u dont mind buying a set of taper shank drill bits .there only realy needed drilling anything over half inch[/QUOTE]


I agree that is not worth using Morse tapers on small sizes but the good thing is that you can pick up large quality Morse taper drills cheaper than you can straight or reduced shank drills.

I have a 5/8" or 16mm capacity Jacobs chuck on my pillar drill but it gets knocked out for anything over about 10-12mm as the shank tends to slip and burr.

I did pull some nice long series 3 MT drills out of the Parker Hannifin skip, various imperial and metric sizes up to about 38mm which had been reground as counterbores, I cut the pilot drill part off and reground them as split point drills.

 

[phill d]

the progress no1 with a slot in the quill is not for knocking out a taper, its for holding the quill while you undo a nut to drop the chuck.
the progress no1 did not have a taper going up into the quill, its like 90% of other bench drills and has a taper on the bottom of the quill itself.
its just the ones with a slot seem to have a thinner spindle or more of it between the chuck and the quill itself. thus weaker.
also on the drills with the slot they seem to have smaller table and much smaller table collars and a shorter pillar, no facilty to raise the lid for a
simple belt speed change without taking the lid off completely & slightly different castings.

but again not all the progress No 1 drills are like this ??? obviously many different marks of the same model.

either way what is the actual taper of the spindle that goes into the chuck ? this is what I want to know, and its correct name or size etc.

once I know this I can get an adaptor that has a taper at each end, thus allowing me to have drill bits etc that are a tapered shaft.
ok so I might lose 4 inches in height, but I can use the base and still have room or swing the head unit around and have loads of room.

and does anyone know how to get the quill pulley off the drill ?
ive got everything else in bits, cant seem to get this out.
I know about the grub screw up at the top by the grease nipple, ive got that out ok..


phill

 

[roofman]

the progress no1 with a slot in the quill is not for knocking out a taper, its for holding the quill while you undo a nut to drop the chuck.
the progress no1 did not have a taper going up into the quill, its like 90% of other bench drills and has a taper on the bottom of the quill itself.
its just the ones with a slot seem to have a thinner spindle or more of it between the chuck and the quill itself. thus weaker.
also on the drills with the slot they seem to have smaller table and much smaller table collars and a shorter pillar, no facilty to raise the lid for a
simple belt speed change without taking the lid off completely & slightly different castings.

but again not all the progress No 1 drills are like this ??? obviously many different marks of the same model.

either way what is the actual taper of the spindle that goes into the chuck ? this is what I want to know, and its correct name or size etc.

once I know this I can get an adaptor that has a taper at each end, thus allowing me to have drill bits etc that are a tapered shaft.
ok so I might lose 4 inches in height, but I can use the base and still have room or swing the head unit around and have loads of room.

phill

i persume it should be J2

 

[phill d]

I don't have any markings on my chuck, it just says Jacobs no34.
the Jacobs new site is useless for info, probably because they are now made in china and NOT uk or USA.

And are all Jacobs chucks with a outside more taper stem able to have the taper bar pulled out of the chuck ?
this would give a huge range of chucks if its possible to do this.

what I want to do is be able to fit a 5/6ths chuck to my drill if possible, that's why I need to know what the taper realy is.

I don't have anything other than Jacobs No34 Sheffield and the 1-13mm & 0-1/2 inch on mine.
nothing in the manual of the drill to say the quill taper

phill

 

[brightspark]

here get the caliper out and measure http://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/projects/Info/chuck-dimensions.html

 

[phill d]

That's a handy little reference guide, keeping that in my list of stuff !!! cheers brightspark.

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ive just got the pillar washers sorted, used a lump of leather and just cut out 3 nice circles for it.
the light I need has to be a maximum of 2.5 inches long inc the fitting/connector.
the one I have is 3 inch and looks silly poking out by 1/2 inch.
not realy wide enough and too long

 

[phill d]

today o took my Jacobs chuck apart to give it a clean out, was very grubby inside and still sticks a tiny bit when almost fully closed due to
dodgy teeth on 1 of the 3 pieces.
now while the chuck was being cleaned I noticed some lettering up where you normally cant see anything at all.
the lettering was J6 or JT6 , so I presume this is the taper in the inside the chuck.
ive looked up a few of Jacobs chucks and they do a jt6 in the size of my chuck so presume that's what it is.

I do find that its pretty simple to get the chuck off my drill by using the knurled chuck release nut with tommy bar and holding the chuck itself with the chuck key.
simply tighten the nut to the chuck then give it a real good hard push and hey presto off it comes.
Nice and simple way to release the chuck.
So now I can look around for anything with a jt6 internal mount and im in business, hope to find a 5/8ths chuck or maybe 5/8th keyless going cheap.
I see chronos sell a keyless 13mm chuck for £21.60 inc postage , but don't know much about their stuff ?
cant be any worse than the new Jacobs stuff, as that is all now made in CHINA yep good old Jacobs is now poop quality Chinese junk. but still charge uk prices.

any views on the chronos stuff or keyless chucks in general for bench/pillar drills. ?




phill

 

[brightspark]

try and get one of ebay now u know the size i got a real good one for a tenner

 

[phill d]

yeah I will keep an eye out for one.
just have to double check the size with callipers to make sure it is a j6 or jt 6 whatever.
seems strange that its not written where you could see it , maybe back when the drill was made it was just the done thing ?

what make and type of chuck did you manage to grab for a tenner ?


phill