Advice on a buying my first welder

[eddie49]

I suppose that for the gas the best thing is to go to a local supplier...

Plenty of realistic options for "real" gas cylinders ( as opposed to the disposable ones ). Search on this Forum for BOC Hobby deal, SGS, Air Liquide Albee, Hobbygas. Argon/CO2 95%/5% is best. Pure CO2 "Pub gas" is a low cost and worse option.
You will need a gas pressure regulator and gauges, e.g.:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Argon-CO...lator-Welding-Weld-Gauges-Welder/352854848354

 

[Fluxia]

thank you very much!!

 

[Mart63]

I use Adams Gas as there is a local supplier in Thurrock. Think they are in Margate, so cover the south east pretty well.

 

[slim_boy_fat]

I use Adams Gas as there is a local supplier in Thurrock. Think they are in Margate, so cover the south east pretty well.

Isn't one of their people a Member here?

 

[Seadog]

Isn't one of their people a Member here?

Alan, Agautosport

 

[Cobbler]

Alan, Agautosport

No he’s South West Gas, not Adams Gas, still rent free bottles though & a rebate for members I think

 

[Seadog]

You are correct.

 

[Memmeddu]

Here in Italy someone bought a CO2 regulator which fits on carbon dioxide fire extinguishers .
Remove the hose fit the regulator depress the lever ,lock it in place ,set your gas flow .
Expired fire extinguisher can be found for almost nothing here and they are usually full charged
We usually take them to use them as said up above ,then we convert them to air tanks , umbrella holders something like that because isn't worth send them to hydrotest and refill (in some cases is possible to get problems with the law )

 

[skotl]

Just to be contrary...

First of all, I agree with all of the advice above - all good tips from people who have been there and done it.

But there's also something to be said for buying a crummy old transformer mig welder (mine was a SIP 150) as little teaches you more about welding than tidying up and fixing a welder and making it half good. OK you can also get extremely frustrated, and it does take a level of dedication to engineering and electrical work (!) but if you're of that mind it can be a very cheap way in to welding!

 

[Fluxia]

I have been looking about getting a gas cylinder... but I getting a bit lost. I need a gas that is suitable for "general use" (so according to the guide on this site it appears that the best option would be 80%Argon/ 20%CO2 mix?
Then I see there is also Argoshield Light from BOC, and they have a sale point not far from me. I see that they rent the cylinders but clearly for an occasional diy user that's not very cost effective.
In their web site ( https://www.boconline.co.uk/shop/en/uk/gas/welding-gas ) there are a number of different bottles, different connectors and I notice that some cylinders have a built in regulator, some require a coupler that costs over £60! .... so basically I am getting lost, far worse that deciding what welder to buy...
Is anybody able to shed a bit of light please?

 

[Munkul]

5% CO2 in Argon is generally a "light" mixture which is the best gas for general use under 200 amps. Usually mixed with 2% oxygen as well, which provides a "wetter" weld bead.

its full makeup is 93/5/2% Ar/CO2/O2.

20% CO2 is a "heavy" mix and it will work just fine, but will spatter more on lower settings, it's less forgiving.

 

[Yamhon]

I've only used disposable regulators; quality varies a good deal but was given both of mine, and a manifold gas system. Without experience of using regulators for argon/c02 my only guide was that I wanted something that I would have confidence in, something that would feel robust and reliable in use. I was weighing up saving up for a larger sized cylinder, which Hobbyweld call their Ultra which comes with its own regulator or buying a regulator so I could use smaller sized cylinders and cylinders from other suppliers. When I found the ESAB Edge 3 at a reasonable price, I opted for that and had it delivered recently. It's worth noting that some of these regulators have ratings for up to 25lpm, wears the one I had delivered is rated for 40lpm.

https://www.weldtech.co.uk/gas-and-...ies-Argon-CO2-Flow-Gauge-Side-Entry-Regulator

Won't get used for a few weeks yet, but it came well packed; as you'd expect for the price. Each opening on the regulator comes with a protective cover and everything about it feels well made and solid. The dials are a little smaller than the impression I had, having seen pictures of them, but there clear and much better than other regulators I've seen. I also like that spare parts are available for these so hopefully it'll be an investment that will last a good number of years.

 

[Fluxia]

hello

I have received today the uptime MIG160 mig welder discussed earlier in this thread. They must have made a mistake and sent me the version with industrial plug so I am planning to get a connector (https://www.toolstation.com/industrial-connectors-ip44/p36883) and attach a normal plug to it with a 16 AMP fuse. The alternative would be to get a separate line from my shed consumer unit with a industrial socket but I wander if this is really required. At the moment I have a radial circuit on a 16 amp breaker and a 2.5 mm cable. So I suppose that using a 2.5mm cable for my extension and a 16 amp fuse in the plug should be fine?

The welder came without wire and the manual states that it can take a 0.8 or 1 mm wire, any suggestions about which one I should get and what are the differences?

and finally the regulator and gas pipe. I have decided to order this gas bottle from Hobby well. seems the most economical for diy use: https://www.londongases.co.uk/view/hobbyweld-5
it states it has a 5/8 connector. I am looking at regulators on amazon right now ... would this be suitable?

https://www.amazon.co.uk/W21-8-Oulet-Pressure-Regulator-Welding/dp/B07CXVK1HM/ref=sr_1_12_sspa?keywords=gas+regulator+welder+argon+co2+5/8&qid=1582729287&sr=8-12-spons&psc=1&smid=A16XKZP8DQLQDK&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUExRzBGUUFUV0g2U1JCJmVuY3J5cHRlZElkPUEwNTQyNTM4M0pIUkNDV1cxUFQ5VSZlbmNyeXB0ZWRBZElkPUEwNDE1OTQ3MTY5QjhOSTlJMTlIVCZ3aWRnZXROYW1lPXNwX2J0ZiZhY3Rpb249Y2xpY2tSZWRpcmVjdCZkb05vdExvZ0NsaWNrPXRydWU=

it states W21.8 (?) - and what a bout the pipe connecting the regulator with the welder (please see welder connector below) it looks like i wil need a gas hoise without any conections at both ends? . (too many questions ... I know....)

 

[peterbye]

"and attach a normal plug to it with a 16 AMP fuse"

No, you can't do that! Don't think you can get a 16A fuse that fits a normal plug anyway.
Unless you're welding at the upper end of the machine's range you'll be fine on 13A.
You can get a ready made adapter - https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B003IJI4G2

 

[Yamhon]

The regulator you choose needs to be suitable for the gas you're using, in this case an argon and c02 mix. Not sure if that regulator you linked to is suitable for argon, an argon c02 mix or c02. That gas connection on the back of your welder looks like a "barb fitting" you can get a gas hose with a bare end which you can push over this, but you'll then need an o-clip or other suitable clip to hold the hose in place.

 

[eddie49]

After the fiasco with 2.5mm2 copper wire soldered across the 13A fuse, Uptime now supply a 16A blue plug. It is shown on their website:
https://www.uptimewelding.co.uk/uptime-mig-welders.html
It is unlikely that the machine will draw more than 13A, especially if you mostly use low power settings, so just remove the blue plug and fit a good-quality 13A plug such as Permaplug or Masterplug.
Most DIY MIG welding is done with 0.8mm wire. The thicker 1mm wire is for use above 180Amps. Thicker wire will pass more current, and deposit more metal. [ There's also 0.6mm wire, but most people don't like it or don't find it necessary. ] Your welder has a drive roller for 0.8 and 1mm. Buy 5Kg of 0.8mm.

You need a side-entry ( SE ) regulator with 2 gauges, for Argon/Argon Mix, not CO2, bottles. The connector to the cylinder will be a male 5/8 inch BSP ( British Standard Pipe ) thread ( which is 22.8mm ), with a cone-shaped seal known as a bullnose. It needs to be side-entry for rent-free cylinders so that the gauges are horizontal. ( BOC rental cylinders have a vertical connector.) Regulators designed for "Pub gas" CO2 cylinders connect with a flat nylon seal held on by a female sleeve nut - these will not fit Hobbyweld Argon Mix cylinders.
Examples of suitable regulators:
https://www.weldequip.com/argon-regulator-se.htm
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/22-8mm-A...ig-Valve-Regulator-Welder-CGA540/163954239704
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Argon-CO...tor-Welding-Gauge-Welder-G5-8-CT/152330080363

One of the gauges lets you know the pressure in the cylinder, typically 150 bar, 2000 psi, which will fall as you use the gas. The vertical ball-bearing "pea-shooter" output gauges with a needle valve are easier to adjust the flow rate ( 8 - 12 litres/min ).
The output connector on the regulator may be 3/8 BSP, for which you will need a hosetail. The later two regulators above have an M12 male thread, already fitted with a coned barbed hosetail swivel fitting for 8mm diameter hose. You will need a couple of metres of 8mm ( 5/16 inch ) clear braided plastic hose:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Braided-...rade-Fish-Pond-Car-Air-Line-Tube/332408046594
and two 11mm hose clips:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Stainles...e-Clamps-Classic-Rubber-PVC-Tube/193045080527
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Zinc-Pla...Pipe-Nut-Bolt-Air-Fuel-Water-AFS/271076156058

 

[Fluxia]

After the fiasco with 2.5mm2 copper wire soldered across the 13A fuse, Uptime now supply a 16A blue plug. It is shown on their website:
https://www.uptimewelding.co.uk/uptime-mig-welders.html
It is unlikely that the machine will draw more than 13A, especially if you mostly use low power settings, so just remove the blue plug and fit a good-quality 13A plug such as Permaplug or Masterplug.
Most DIY MIG welding is done with 0.8mm wire. The thicker 1mm wire is for use above 180Amps. Thicker wire will pass more current, and deposit more metal. [ There's also 0.6mm wire, but most people don't like it or don't find it necessary. ] Your welder has a drive roller for 0.8 and 1mm. Buy 5Kg of 0.8mm.

You need a side-entry ( SE ) regulator with 2 gauges, for Argon/Argon Mix, not CO2, bottles. The connector to the cylinder will be a male 5/8 inch BSP ( British Standard Pipe ) thread ( which is 22.8mm ), with a cone-shaped seal known as a bullnose. It needs to be side-entry for rent-free cylinders so that the gauges are horizontal. ( BOC rental cylinders have a vertical connector.) Regulators designed for "Pub gas" CO2 cylinders connect with a flat nylon seal held on by a female sleeve nut - these will not fit Hobbyweld Argon Mix cylinders.
Examples of suitable regulators:
https://www.weldequip.com/argon-regulator-se.htm
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/22-8mm-A...ig-Valve-Regulator-Welder-CGA540/163954239704
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Argon-CO...tor-Welding-Gauge-Welder-G5-8-CT/152330080363

One of the gauges lets you know the pressure in the cylinder, typically 150 bar, 2000 psi, which will fall as you use the gas. The vertical ball-bearing "pea-shooter" output gauges with a needle valve are easier to adjust the flow rate ( 8 - 12 litres/min ).
The output connector on the regulator may be 3/8 BSP, for which you will need a hosetail. The later two regulators above have an M12 male thread, already fitted with a coned barbed hosetail swivel fitting for 8mm diameter hose. You will need a couple of metres of 8mm ( 5/16 inch ) clear braided plastic hose:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Braided-...rade-Fish-Pond-Car-Air-Line-Tube/332408046594
and two 11mm hose clips:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Stainles...e-Clamps-Classic-Rubber-PVC-Tube/193045080527
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Zinc-Pla...Pipe-Nut-Bolt-Air-Fuel-Water-AFS/271076156058

BRILLIANT!!
THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR THE DETAILED AND CLEAR RESPONSE!

 

[Fluxia]

After the fiasco with 2.5mm2 copper wire soldered across the 13A fuse, Uptime now supply a 16A blue plug. It is shown on their website:
https://www.uptimewelding.co.uk/uptime-mig-welders.html
It is unlikely that the machine will draw more than 13A, especially if you mostly use low power settings, so just remove the blue plug and fit a good-quality 13A plug such as Permaplug or Masterplug.

I have open the industrial plug (they now provide a 32amp plug actually) to change it to a normal 13amp plug and noticed that this how it is connected inside...please see pic below.
the blue wire is connected to the L/+ bit and the brown one to the other connector.
surely they should be connected the other way round. I am suppose to do the same in the 13 amp plug ?

 

[Yamhon]

I have open the industrial plug (they now provide a 32amp plug actually) to change it to a normal 13amp plug and noticed that this how it is connected inside...please see pic below.
the blue wire is connected to the L/+ bit and the brown one to the other connector.
surely they should be connected the other way round. I am suppose to do the same in the 13 amp plug ?

If you intend to run your welding machine off a standard 13amp socket, I'd suggest using one of these fly leads which is designed to allow you to plug a 16amp plug into a 13amp socket. I used one before I had a 16amp socket installed.

https://www.toolstation.com/fly-lead-socket-convertor/p47166

 

[Shedendman]

It'll still be 13amp