boc adr 300

[julieanncharters]

yes, mine does the same

remove the left cover and you will see three lengths of round bar butted up to each other with a slight gap

take them off and re-face them and set the gap at about 12thou

don't ya just luv this forum cheers again M8.
any idea what 12thou is in metric without me looking it up?
elfyn

 

[Ian D]

What a beast, good luck with it.

 

[shenion]

Looks similar vintage to my Airco

Mine had issues with HF start/stop due to the start circuit. There was an open resistor that controls the arc start detect (measures OCV). It also effected the hot start in arc mode (less noticeable.)

 

[Paul.]

any idea what 12thou is in metric without me looking it up?
elfyn

12 thou is about 0.3mm, but I think that's a bit tight, I've always set them to about 30 to 35 Thou or around 0.9mm, If the HF is working on AC though I doubt if thats the problem.

 

[shenion]

Hmm the manual on mu Airco says 0.010" max (same for Miller and others). Anything higher will stress the HF caps.

mine was at 0.020 when i got it and the HF caps had leaked out oil from overheating.

 

[Paul.]

Just checked an Esab heliarc, and a Murex transtig manual, 0.030", and 0.035" respectively, probably the best thing is for Elfyn to try and get hold of an ADR manual,

 

[shenion]

Liiks like Craig Westerman has the manual (highe rup thread.) He should get it from him.

 

[julieanncharters]

12 thou is about 0.3mm, but I think that's a bit tight, I've always set them to about 30 to 35 Thou or around 0.9mm, If the HF is working on AC though I doubt if thats the problem.

yep your right i cleaned/refaced hf contacts and set 12 thou and still the same
******.
forgot to mention set is badged Rowen-arc 300 but looks identical to adr 300
i'm told they are same set ?
seems to be 2 adjustable hf contact rods held in place by 2 grub screws on each end.
2 rods are 6-7mm diameter not 3 larger ones shown end to end on a previous thread..
apart from that insides of machine on the thread look the same as the one here.
i've had a copy of westermans manual but its not complete lots of usefull pages missing.
i have no problem following wiring diagrams ,served me time with the stuff.
and yes its a beast from every angle
there's a mention of a suspect relay on arc strike hf giving problems ,worth a test.
.

 

[michael1703]

mine wont hf start until ive scratched it and then it hf's every time

i hardly use mine as its so bloody loud, let me know how much din your fan makes

 

[julieanncharters]

mine wont hf start until ive scratched it and then it hf's every time

i hardly use mine as its so bloody loud, let me know how much din your fan makes

fan noise is ok its not as loud as me old murex 500amp synergic mig .
lucky for me the power station is only down the road
i'm all for progress, when i fire up the little r tech 160 dc tig set you could hear a spider fart in the workshop, heaven

 

[NotANormalCoder]

I always set spark points to 0.008" each when servicing these sets, as much more than that and the HF starts to 'misfire' then cut out when welding decent long welds on Ally - I think the HF capacitor can't take the strain.
HF start on DC is controlled by RL3 and RL4. RL4 is the strange 'Post Office' relay, usually covered by a protective metal cover and located on the vertical panel, inside the front and with the other relays. The purpose of RL4 is to energise when welding voltage is present on the output, switching ON the HF, then de-energise when the arc is struck, switching OFF the HF. As they are exposed to all sorts of high voltages, these relays regularly pack up and are no longer available.
However, it's worth checking RL3 (and all the other relays too) as lots of the problems I encounter are faulty relays and broken joins in the wiring. Make sure you put the correct relays back in their positions as they are not all the same!
This machine was indeed supplied to BOC, Rowen Arc & Philips, in 200 and 300 Amp versions. I still even have the original Blueprints from Hirst Welding Rectifiers who designed the machine and these are dated around 1968!
A great machine but huge in comparison to modern machines.
Dave

 

[julieanncharters]

I always set spark points to 0.008" each when servicing these sets, as much more than that and the HF starts to 'misfire' then cut out when welding decent long welds on Ally - I think the HF capacitor can't take the strain.
HF start on DC is controlled by RL3 and RL4. RL4 is the strange 'Post Office' relay, usually covered by a protective metal cover and located on the vertical panel, inside the front and with the other relays. The purpose of RL4 is to energise when welding voltage is present on the output, switching ON the HF, then de-energise when the arc is struck, switching OFF the HF. As they are exposed to all sorts of high voltages, these relays regularly pack up and are no longer available.
However, it's worth checking RL3 (and all the other relays too) as lots of the problems I encounter are faulty relays and broken joins in the wiring. Make sure you put the correct relays back in their positions as they are not all the same!
This machine was indeed supplied to BOC, Rowen Arc & Philips, in 200 and 300 Amp versions. I still even have the original Blueprints from Hirst Welding Rectifiers who designed the machine and these are dated around 1968!
A great machine but huge in comparison to modern machines.
Dave

Thanks for the info dave i'll have a look at them.
elfyn

 

[julieanncharters]

I always set spark points to 0.008" each when servicing these sets, as much more than that and the HF starts to 'misfire' then cut out when welding decent long welds on Ally - I think the HF capacitor can't take the strain.
HF start on DC is controlled by RL3 and RL4. RL4 is the strange 'Post Office' relay, usually covered by a protective metal cover and located on the vertical panel, inside the front and with the other relays. The purpose of RL4 is to energise when welding voltage is present on the output, switching ON the HF, then de-energise when the arc is struck, switching OFF the HF. As they are exposed to all sorts of high voltages, these relays regularly pack up and are no longer available.
However, it's worth checking RL3 (and all the other relays too) as lots of the problems I encounter are faulty relays and broken joins in the wiring. Make sure you put the correct relays back in their positions as they are not all the same!
This machine was indeed supplied to BOC, Rowen Arc & Philips, in 200 and 300 Amp versions. I still even have the original Blueprints from Hirst Welding Rectifiers who designed the machine and these are dated around 1968!
A great machine but huge in comparison to modern machines.
Dave

just gone thru this dave and Relay 4 the "BT" one has open circut on the coil.
all others are more modern RS type and are ok.

if i manually operate with a stick in the cycle the hf on arc strike works.
anyone know were can source one second hand? hens teeth as a second choice.
failing that a retro modern replacement.

 

[julieanncharters]

well at a loose end so stripped the "BT" relay coil and found open end due to corrosion on one end.
re-solder and reassembly and hey presto full working adr HF.
thank again to all who have posted all the info and supplied drawings so i could fix the ugly beast.
she'll prob see me out
elfyn

 

[shenion]

Glad to hear it is working

Sounds very similar to my Airco with 4 relays in a box on the side.

A note on the HF caps, check for leaking. mine were 4000V. This is probably why the gap is so small. I replaced them with 10KV caps and it works well. others have said using higher voltage caps improves the operation.

 

[michael1703]

glad to hear its working.... if you are ever in suffolk, you can fix mine

 

[julieanncharters]

glad to hear its working.... if you are ever in suffolk, you can fix mine

if you were a bit nearer n wales you'd have a good chance.
whats yours not doin then?