whensparksfly
Member
- Messages
- 658
- Location
- ireland
Can you modify a 9100xx to air feed?I have a 9100xx and a adflo set up can I buy or fit a duct to the 9100i have
- Thread starter whensparksfly
- Start date
Parm
Respect The Sound System
- Messages
- 17,897
- Location
- Towcester
yes you can, of course you can
but it will probably cost you upwards of £25 k to have it all tested by a notified body and have the necessary reassurance to demonstrate that it all works
other answers are available (that probably you may want to hear) but they will all be wrong
but it will probably cost you upwards of £25 k to have it all tested by a notified body and have the necessary reassurance to demonstrate that it all works
other answers are available (that probably you may want to hear) but they will all be wrong
hotponyshoes
Member
- Messages
- 7,048
- Location
- Somerset. Uk
The ducting is part of the shell.
You can buy the bare adflo shell and put your bits into it if you want.
I think that might be a bit cheaper than £25k as that's how it comes when you buy it from 3m anyway.
You can buy the bare adflo shell and put your bits into it if you want.
I think that might be a bit cheaper than £25k as that's how it comes when you buy it from 3m anyway.
rory1
Member
- Messages
- 1,201
- Location
- Macclesfield
All of the speedglas helmets are adaptable to airfed. Parts are available to convert all speedglas to airfed
Might be a bit of confusion between "air fed" and "adflow".
Air fed to me means a full on positive pressure sealed face enclosure to prevent you breathing in anything other than what is supplied down the hose from a filtered remote source.
Adflow converted wedling hat is a flow of filtered air from just behind you into the mask in the general area of your breathing in gear, reducing the amount of welding fumes you breathe in.
Air fed to me means a full on positive pressure sealed face enclosure to prevent you breathing in anything other than what is supplied down the hose from a filtered remote source.
Adflow converted wedling hat is a flow of filtered air from just behind you into the mask in the general area of your breathing in gear, reducing the amount of welding fumes you breathe in.
Chris Snow
Member
- Messages
- 188
- Location
- Nottingham
Can you? Of course you can. You could diy the whole thing if you wanted.
Should you? For personal use sure do whatever you like. As an employee or employer certainly not unless it's a manufacturer approved upgrade path.
Should you? For personal use sure do whatever you like. As an employee or employer certainly not unless it's a manufacturer approved upgrade path.
Munkul
Jack of some trades, Master of none
- Messages
- 7,611
- Location
- Cumbria
No different to disassembling an adflo hood according to the manual for cleaning and then re-assembling, or replacing a damaged part. In effect it's a brand new hood, using the ADF and headgear from the old hood.
3M Speedglas 9100 FX Welding Helmet Shell - Without Headband
Replacement 3M Speedglas Welding Helmet 9100 FX without welding filter, without headband. For maximum safety and comfort, make it a habit to check your equipment regularly. Replace worn out or damaged parts. Not compatible with Adflo.
www.craigmoreonline.co.uk
Competence in this case is easy to prove, and if you say it isn't, then STOP THE WHOLE WORLD! from any sort of work whatsoever
Last edited by a moderator:
Munkul
Jack of some trades, Master of none
- Messages
- 7,611
- Location
- Cumbria
Yeah you're right, PAPR is totally different to air-fed.
Parm's right technically in that if you want to offer a new or modifed PAPR system for sale to others, or wear it in the workplace, it better be tested to the relevant standard, or it's illegal.
Having said that, no-one can stop you from making your own PPE for your own recreational enjoyment in a non-working setting.
- Messages
- 17,317
It looks like the only difference is the lack of an aperture in the top of the non-adflo shell for the inlet?
If an aperture is cut correctly and is sealed to the inlet as per the factory one then I see no reason why it would be any different to an adflo one bought off the shelf?
The 9100xx without adflo:
The 9100xx with adflo:
If an aperture is cut correctly and is sealed to the inlet as per the factory one then I see no reason why it would be any different to an adflo one bought off the shelf?
The 9100xx without adflo:
The 9100xx with adflo:
every used car ive ever bought came with at least four part worn tyres ,,, never worried me then , wouldnt worry me in the future ,,,,
hotponyshoes
Member
- Messages
- 7,048
- Location
- Somerset. Uk
Firstly, I don't know the OP from Adam.
I have nothing to gain from giving him the "answers he wants"
In fact, I have an adflo system here doing nothing and I would be better off telling him that it's not possible to adapt his and trying to flog him mine!
Secondly, No, I'm not an expert.
This is a post in an equipment section on a welding forum.
If the OP wants expert professional advice he can get in a consultant and pay for it.
He has no way of knowing who I am or how much crap I am capable of sprouting.
At the same time, he also has no reason to listen to any other "experts" who tell him it can't be done.
He's not paying me anything so I'm not too worried about ending up in court for whatever I tell him to do.
I could tell him that it's ok to tuck 2 socks under his chin and spray 2 pack all day.
If he's stupid enough to believe me then he's more likely to get run down crossing the street without looking rather than eventually die from the paint fumes.
Despite not having an internationally recognised qualification in the subject,
I do purchase welding equipment and I do actually use it every now and again.
What I do KNOW, that maybe the op does not, (hence why I posted) is that if you buy an air fed mask kit from 3M (who I think are pretty competent)
You get 3 boxes in the kit.
The mask shell, the adf filter and the adflo pack.
This makes up a kit that (and correct me if I'm wrong) has been passed to be safe when used in accordance with the instructions.
The op clearly stated that he had a mask and an adflo pack.
I KNOW enough to recognise the part numbers that he has posted.
I KNOW that the only difference between his stuff and the full adflo kit is the shell of the helmet as the adflo version has an integrated duct.
I KNOW that not only do 3M sell this part separately (with instructions on how to convert to an adflo system) but they also advertise it as the way to upgrade their standard masks to adflo.
I could also mention that they also sell adaptors to connect various types of blower unit to various types of helmet but I don't want anyone's head to explode with the thought that a big company like 3M is obviously happy to try and kill us all.
What I also KNOW is if the OP walks into any welding suppliers in the country (or calls a 3M rep to visit his workplace) and tells them what he needs, what they offer him would constitute as professional advice.
I KNOW they would supply him with a full system with change from £1000.
Now, just because I have written 'know' in capitals a few times obviously doesn't mean they the OP has any more reason to believe or trust what I say.
But seing as there is potentially a £24,000 saving to be had, it might be worth him thinking about it.
It also seems from the links posted above that, either I'm not the only fairy-tale-teller
Or, is it possible that I am not the only one that can read and actually researches and uses this gear.
Nobody is telling anybody to use gaffa tape or string. They have just tried to be helpful and directed the OP to a manafactures approved method.
Obviously none of these guys offering advice have shown any proof of any sort of qualifications but then nobody has offered any help on how he would go about getting his own system tested if he did want to blow £25k on it either.
You don't need to be an expert.
I would think 3m are pretty well qualified to advise in this sort of thing.
Just send them an email with the part numbers of what you have, tell them what you want to do and they will send you back a list of what part numbers you need to do the conversion.
Then you have a nice written record for when the h&s boys come knocking
I have nothing to gain from giving him the "answers he wants"
In fact, I have an adflo system here doing nothing and I would be better off telling him that it's not possible to adapt his and trying to flog him mine!
Secondly, No, I'm not an expert.
This is a post in an equipment section on a welding forum.
If the OP wants expert professional advice he can get in a consultant and pay for it.
He has no way of knowing who I am or how much crap I am capable of sprouting.
At the same time, he also has no reason to listen to any other "experts" who tell him it can't be done.
He's not paying me anything so I'm not too worried about ending up in court for whatever I tell him to do.
I could tell him that it's ok to tuck 2 socks under his chin and spray 2 pack all day.
If he's stupid enough to believe me then he's more likely to get run down crossing the street without looking rather than eventually die from the paint fumes.
Despite not having an internationally recognised qualification in the subject,
I do purchase welding equipment and I do actually use it every now and again.
What I do KNOW, that maybe the op does not, (hence why I posted) is that if you buy an air fed mask kit from 3M (who I think are pretty competent)
You get 3 boxes in the kit.
The mask shell, the adf filter and the adflo pack.
This makes up a kit that (and correct me if I'm wrong) has been passed to be safe when used in accordance with the instructions.
The op clearly stated that he had a mask and an adflo pack.
I KNOW enough to recognise the part numbers that he has posted.
I KNOW that the only difference between his stuff and the full adflo kit is the shell of the helmet as the adflo version has an integrated duct.
I KNOW that not only do 3M sell this part separately (with instructions on how to convert to an adflo system) but they also advertise it as the way to upgrade their standard masks to adflo.
I could also mention that they also sell adaptors to connect various types of blower unit to various types of helmet but I don't want anyone's head to explode with the thought that a big company like 3M is obviously happy to try and kill us all.
What I also KNOW is if the OP walks into any welding suppliers in the country (or calls a 3M rep to visit his workplace) and tells them what he needs, what they offer him would constitute as professional advice.
I KNOW they would supply him with a full system with change from £1000.
Now, just because I have written 'know' in capitals a few times obviously doesn't mean they the OP has any more reason to believe or trust what I say.
But seing as there is potentially a £24,000 saving to be had, it might be worth him thinking about it.
It also seems from the links posted above that, either I'm not the only fairy-tale-teller
Or, is it possible that I am not the only one that can read and actually researches and uses this gear.
Nobody is telling anybody to use gaffa tape or string. They have just tried to be helpful and directed the OP to a manafactures approved method.
Obviously none of these guys offering advice have shown any proof of any sort of qualifications but then nobody has offered any help on how he would go about getting his own system tested if he did want to blow £25k on it either.
You don't need to be an expert.
I would think 3m are pretty well qualified to advise in this sort of thing.
Just send them an email with the part numbers of what you have, tell them what you want to do and they will send you back a list of what part numbers you need to do the conversion.
Then you have a nice written record for when the h&s boys come knocking
Last edited by a moderator:
Parm
Respect The Sound System
- Messages
- 17,897
- Location
- Towcester
Modifying RPE is the ultimate no no
In terms of the hierarchy of control it’s at the bottom of the tree and the last resort.
the reason it MUST be conformity assessed by a re cognised notified body is that the notified body ensures it meets the relevant performance standard, which in this case is BS EN 12491
We are all capable of buying the parts on the internet, making a few holes and fitting parts. BUT, AND I REPEAT BUT, none of us are capable of ensuring that any home made modifications with OEM equipment will work
BUT few people understand that you do not modify RPE
the attitude displayed in this thread is fairly typical of the I know it all and I can do everything attitude I see regularly
we are all capable of drilling holes and bodging Thinks up, but non of us know about conformity testing to the relevant stanadard.
you can all do whatever you want, but in my book anyone that advocates DIY modification to RPE should be held criminally responsible
In terms of the hierarchy of control it’s at the bottom of the tree and the last resort.
the reason it MUST be conformity assessed by a re cognised notified body is that the notified body ensures it meets the relevant performance standard, which in this case is BS EN 12491
We are all capable of buying the parts on the internet, making a few holes and fitting parts. BUT, AND I REPEAT BUT, none of us are capable of ensuring that any home made modifications with OEM equipment will work
BUT few people understand that you do not modify RPE
the attitude displayed in this thread is fairly typical of the I know it all and I can do everything attitude I see regularly
we are all capable of drilling holes and bodging Thinks up, but non of us know about conformity testing to the relevant stanadard.
you can all do whatever you want, but in my book anyone that advocates DIY modification to RPE should be held criminally responsible
Last edited by a moderator:
- Messages
- 13,438
- Location
- England
The shell is the cheap bit. Im not very familiar with the adflo stuff, always had Nederman/Esab, It wont be just pop a hose in the top, there will probably be air ducts/deflectors etc inside too, plus the face seals.
Best bet is probably to buy an adflo ready 9100 shell, and just fit your 9100xx lense.
9100 is the shell, 9100xx is the lense isnt it?
Best bet is probably to buy an adflo ready 9100 shell, and just fit your 9100xx lense.
9100 is the shell, 9100xx is the lense isnt it?
- Messages
- 13,438
- Location
- England
MOD EDIT>>
Ive had a tidy up of this thread.
I havn't locked this at the moment as relevant information on both side is appropriate.
Lets be a little sensible about the manner in which we conduct ourselves, and keep a sensible conversation.
Ive had a tidy up of this thread.
I havn't locked this at the moment as relevant information on both side is appropriate.
Lets be a little sensible about the manner in which we conduct ourselves, and keep a sensible conversation.
HughF
Member
- Messages
- 6,469
- Location
- Work: Dorchester, Workshop: Corfe Castle, Wife's place: Frome
Given that the hse guidance is that papr/adflo/whatever you want to call it has to be used in conjunction with local fume extraction (because, let's face it, adflo systems aren't really that good), does it even fall into the category of rpe?
It doesn't use a proper face seal, it doesn't use bottled air supply, it doesn't have an exposure duration (yes, the filters do, but I'm talking about the face and neck seals here)...
It doesn't use a proper face seal, it doesn't use bottled air supply, it doesn't have an exposure duration (yes, the filters do, but I'm talking about the face and neck seals here)...
owas
Member
- Messages
- 2,312
- Location
- Birmingham
Parm
Respect The Sound System
- Messages
- 17,897
- Location
- Towcester
PAPR is a category III item of RPE that gives demonstrable performance. There is a reason it doesn’t have a seal. I leave you to find out why
it’s a very important bit of kit in any RPE programme
Munkul
Jack of some trades, Master of none
- Messages
- 7,611
- Location
- Cumbria
It would be a bad job if it was assessed against that standard - since it's for paragliding equipment
Do you not mean BS EN 12941 (ok I know it was a typo)
