madkayaker
Pro sparkey Pro Welder
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much better! cleaning the plate first with a grinder (flap disks best) will help matters as well
- Thread starter Semtex
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rtbcomp
Moderator
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Steady the rod with a spare hand.
Also some rods work better when warm, so after a couple of false starts pause a while to let the temperature of the rod even out a bit and have another go.
Some people even keep their rods in the airing cupboard.
Also some rods work better when warm, so after a couple of false starts pause a while to let the temperature of the rod even out a bit and have another go.
Some people even keep their rods in the airing cupboard.
There's a difference between
'being a quitter' - giving up without really trying - and flogging a dead horse.
There's also such thing as setting yourself up for failure.
It's been put to me that a good workman can't blame his tools because part of being a good workman is always using the best tools.
Anyway, very good tools for one purpose are worse than useless for a related purpose. e.g. a thousand quid industrial soldering station for electronics production is no use for stained glass work and not that much use for field repairs.
Wise conclusions.
It gets easier with practice but there are a few things you can do.
It's easier with a flip down or auto headshield because you have two hands to grip the electrode holder. You can also use one hand to hold the rod part way down. From one of the pictures, it looks as if you are using an auto headshield.
If you clamp a piece of scrap to the work you can strike the rod on that and run a tiny bead and it's then much easier to strike a hot rod on the work. Some people strike the rod on the earth clamp.
All those bits of rod of usable length are worth putting in a jam jar and keeping somewhere dry. They come in very handy for when you just want to tack something or there isn't room to work with a full rod.
If you are using a rod that's already been part burned and is cold, the coating will extend further than the core wire and it's harder to start because you have to scratch until you get to the core wire.
There are a couple of ways of starting the arc, tap and scratch, and starting the arc is worth practising in its own right. Inverters make starting the arc easier because the electronics detect that's what you are trying to do and throw everything at it for a fraction of a second. Some rods can't be used easily with a buzz box.
Omniata
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I sincerely disagree...
A member of my family that died shortly before Christmas due to cancer was a time served workman in many trades from engineering to plumbing, etc...
He had a basic set of hand tools that would probably be described as "rubbish" by today's standards but he always did a perfect job...
A good workman can do a good job with any tool
Semtex
Member
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- 40
I sincerely disagree...
A member of my family that died shortly before Christmas due to cancer was a time served workman in many trades from engineering to plumbing, etc...
He had a basic set of hand tools that would probably be described as "rubbish" by today's standards but he always did a perfect job...
A good workman can do a good job with any tool
Perhaps a better way of putting it would be "a good workman always uses the CORRECT tools"
From what feedback i've been getting, an arc is not the CORRECT tool for job I want it to do
simples
tflnemesis
Member
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- 650
Just a little bit of info, it IS possible to arc weld car body work. I used to own an old fiesta 1.6 diesel that was a complete rot box. My father in law completely rebuilt the engine bay using an arc welder, sills and a couple of patches in the floor.
However this bloke is an agricultural engineer (fixes tractors and combines etc) and has been welding for 30+ years, he can gas and arc weld, refuses to touch mig. I have seen this guy use an oxy kit to cut a bearing seized onto a stub axle barely touching the stub axle itself. Its all down to experience and watching this guy welding is an experience itself!!
However this bloke is an agricultural engineer (fixes tractors and combines etc) and has been welding for 30+ years, he can gas and arc weld, refuses to touch mig. I have seen this guy use an oxy kit to cut a bearing seized onto a stub axle barely touching the stub axle itself. Its all down to experience and watching this guy welding is an experience itself!!
octo0072000
Member
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- south yorks
shoes
you need to get some Boots on
open plastic frogs/clogs are not much good when you get sparks between the toes
you need to get some Boots on
open plastic frogs/clogs are not much good when you get sparks between the toes
Semtex
Member
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I was unsure whether to share these with you or not..........but what the hell.
Firstly, as advised, I went out and bought a new toy (No not a mig.........yet)
A flap disc for the angle grinder.
Now being a stubborn git I pulled the lada wing out again (remember the pics on the blog) and had another go with a 1.6 rod and the buzzbox on the lowest setting I could get. A little bit of playing with the settings and this was the result.
Not a brilliant picture, but I managed to get a couple of good runs and blew a hell of a lot less holes in that than last time
For comparison, here's both ends of the wing.
Now, there is a bit of an improvement.
I've now concluded that,
1/ it may be possible for a very good welder to maybe spot weld in the front wings in to the lada with an arc.
2/ I'm not that "very good welder"
The hardest part again is getting started especially at that low a setting.
FYI the lada wing must be about 1 mm at the most, where as this.
This must be about 1.5 - 2 mm thick.
Plan A is still to get a Mig.
Plan B is to persevere with the stick welding for the time being because as well as the cars, I also play with these.
and we have a couple of these down the railway.
Both of which seem to be of much thicker metal than a car.
Firstly, as advised, I went out and bought a new toy (No not a mig.........yet)
A flap disc for the angle grinder.
Now being a stubborn git
I pulled the lada wing out again (remember the pics on the blog) and had another go with a 1.6 rod and the buzzbox on the lowest setting I could get. A little bit of playing with the settings and this was the result.
Not a brilliant picture, but I managed to get a couple of good runs and blew a hell of a lot less holes in that than last time
For comparison, here's both ends of the wing.
Now, there is a bit of an improvement.
I've now concluded that,
1/ it may be possible for a very good welder to maybe spot weld in the front wings in to the lada with an arc.
2/ I'm not that "very good welder"
The hardest part again is getting started especially at that low a setting.
FYI the lada wing must be about 1 mm at the most, where as this.
This must be about 1.5 - 2 mm thick.
Plan A is still to get a Mig.
Plan B is to persevere with the stick welding for the time being because as well as the cars, I also play with these.
and we have a couple of these down the railway.
Both of which seem to be of much thicker metal than a car.
shenion
Tool Pack Rat
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- Stone Mountain, GA USA
Hard to see in those small pictures (show up abut 2" square here.) So, cant advise on the welds. They look like a decent start.
Still a bit uneven. The thing with arc (and MIG) is controlling the weld pool. A bit harder with arc as you have that glowing slag covering the pool. Some rods you can see the pool is yellow while the slag is orange.
Concentrate on forming a pool and growing the front edge along. The tip of the rod should never leave the pool.
6013 rods you can drag lightly. Helps maintain a consistent arc length. They tend to need this length as the flux burns off slower than the rod.
What type, brand and size rods are you using?
Still a bit uneven. The thing with arc (and MIG) is controlling the weld pool. A bit harder with arc as you have that glowing slag covering the pool. Some rods you can see the pool is yellow while the slag is orange.
Concentrate on forming a pool and growing the front edge along. The tip of the rod should never leave the pool.
6013 rods you can drag lightly. Helps maintain a consistent arc length. They tend to need this length as the flux burns off slower than the rod.
What type, brand and size rods are you using?
Semtex
Member
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- 40
Yeah, not very good piccs......taken with a camera phone
Hope these come out a bit better........closer
The big hole in the middle is where the side indicator was........not me
Bearing in mind this is the 3rd time ever I have touched any form of welder. Yes the advice about the thicker steel is the way forward. I just wanted to prove to myself that it might just be slightly possible....Like I said, I'm stubborn
I don't know what type or brand the rods are. Only that the ones today were 1.6 and the ones on the thicker steel were 2.0 (cheapies bought from pool market)
Hope these come out a bit better........closer
The big hole in the middle is where the side indicator was........not me
Bearing in mind this is the 3rd time ever I have touched any form of welder. Yes the advice about the thicker steel is the way forward. I just wanted to prove to myself that it might just be slightly possible....Like I said, I'm stubborn
I don't know what type or brand the rods are. Only that the ones today were 1.6 and the ones on the thicker steel were 2.0 (cheapies bought from pool market)
shenion
Tool Pack Rat
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- Stone Mountain, GA USA
Box store rods tend to be hit and miss and harder to see and feel. The cheapies I have make it real hard to stay under the slag.
Get some name-brand rods. I find I can buy a 5lb box for near what the discount stores sell the 1lb tubes for.
I found the 2mm rods easier on thin metal as the 1.6's put down more slag than metal.
Get some name-brand rods. I find I can buy a 5lb box for near what the discount stores sell the 1lb tubes for.
I found the 2mm rods easier on thin metal as the 1.6's put down more slag than metal.
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Slightly off topic, where's the railway based, always looking for places to go when holidaying in Kernow
Semtex
Member
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Its the Helston Railway which is based in the gardens of Trevarno estate, just outside of Helston.
Its a fledgeling outfit (we don't actually run trains at the moment, but maybe next year)
We have just carried our first passengers (members only) in the black shunter I posted a pic of.
http://www.helstonrailway.co.uk/
I warn you there are some dodgy pictures in the photo gallery (open day 2011)..............me
- Messages
- 22,517
- Location
- Birmingham
Its the Helston Railway which is based in the gardens of Trevarno estate, just outside of Helston.
Its a fledgeling outfit (we don't actually run trains at the moment, but maybe next year)
We have just carried our first passengers (members only) in the black shunter I posted a pic of.
http://www.helstonrailway.co.uk/
I warn you there are some dodgy pictures in the photo gallery (open day 2011)..............me
Sounds good, we are staying in Ashton ( about 4 miles from Helston) this year, would I be able to see anything?
Semtex
Member
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Come down on a Sunday, you have to pay to enter the gardens. You will see the loco's and rolling stock. The museum/shop will be open and you will seeus guys somewhere working around. Last weekend I was on the dumper preparing the trackbed. A week from tomorrow I will be taking basic training in becoming a trainee loco driver (classroom based to allow me to actually get in the cab and learn to drive hands on)
You may be lucky and see a loco running up and down the tracks. When are you coming down.
