compressor for spray painting

[rcx132]

What’s the electric Sundstrom you guys are talking about? Are you just talking about the battery powered electric filter pack? As that’s not a substitute for an air-fed mask if that’s what you are talking about.

Yes my two 14.5cfm compressors will run my spray gun and air fed mask no bother.

Yes the electric mask. According to Swedish department tests it is isocyanate safe. Yes two compressors would work. I have one plus two DIY compressors but plan to switch to two 14 CFM machines and sell the DIY compressors.

 

[Burdekin]

Yes the electric mask. According to Swedish department tests it is isocyanate safe. Yes two compressors would work. I have one plus two DIY compressors but plan to switch to two 14 CFM machines and sell the DIY compressors.

It is filtered and not positive pressure air fed, so not in compliance with what the HSE specify for isocyanates. It is the same as wearing an organic particle mask.

 

[rcx132]

It is filtered and not positive pressure air fed, so not in compliance with what the HSE specify for isocyanates. It is the same as wearing an organic particle mask.

Wouldn't the electric one be positive pressure?

HSE is a UK department. Sunstrum is Swedish certified. If you read the Sunstrum literature their testing, done in conjunction with their country's H&S department, showed that activated carbon filters iso-cyanates very well. Who knows why our HSE went down the air fed route. Maybe they didn't bother testing the carbon filters or maybe they were being prudent or maybe they were concerned about leaks around a non-pressurised mask. 3M told me by phone that they won't approve a filter mask for iso-cynate use because there's no way of telling if the filter has failed. I don't fully see the logic their myself.

I think that the Sunstrum is a viable option for DIYers who don't need to comply with HSE and don't want to invest in more expensive and less practical air fed masks.

 

[Burdekin]

Wouldn't the electric one be positive pressure?

HSE is a UK department. Sunstrum is Swedish certified. If you read the Sunstrum literature their testing, done in conjunction with their country's H&S department, showed that activated carbon filters iso-cyanates very well. Who knows why our HSE went down the air fed route. Maybe they didn't bother testing the carbon filters or maybe they were being prudent or maybe they were concerned about leaks around a non-pressurised mask. 3M told me by phone that they won't approve a filter mask for iso-cynate use because there's no way of telling if the filter has failed. I don't fully see the logic their myself.

I think that the Sunstrum is a viable option for DIYers who don't need to comply with HSE and don't want to invest in more expensive and less practical air fed masks.

Sundstrom state it is equivalent to their other filtered masks. It is wrong to say it is a equivalent or a substitute for an air fed system. You may chose to use it but it is misleading to say it is as safe or an acceptable.substitute.

Forum mods should review the above comments with regard to whether this is safe advice with regard to spraying isocyanates paints.

 

[rcx132]

Sundstrom state it is equivalent to their other filtered masks. It is wrong to say it is a equivalent or a substitute for an air fed system. You may chose to use it but it is misleading to say it is as safe or an acceptable.substitute.

Forum mods should review the above comments with regard to whether this is safe advice with regard to spraying isocyanates paints.

Sundstrum state that they have an isocyanate safe mask approved by their countries government.

 

[stumpy1975]

What abot the gerson 8000 series masks guys they claim to be isocyanate safe but being disposable and i have witnessed a bodyshop painter using on while painting outside on a hot day using 2k paint

 

[rcx132]

When I get home I will post link to Sundstrum literature on using their mask with isocyanate. Users need to be sure they fit the right approved filters and read thru the manufacturers advice as there are time limits and other rules that apply.

What abot the gerson 8000 series masks guys they claim to be isocyanate safe but being disposable and i have witnessed a bodyshop painter using on while painting outside on a hot day using 2k paint

I would only using a mask that has been tested and approved by a trusted authority. I really wouldn't trust what people "say" with something so dangerous.

 

[Burdekin]

What abot the gerson 8000 series masks guys they claim to be isocyanate safe but being disposable and i have witnessed a bodyshop painter using on while painting outside on a hot day using 2k paint

Post it up to show us.

http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/forum/threads/2k-safety-leason-learnt.14051/

http://www.hse.gov.uk/mvr/bodyshop/isocyanates.htm

http://www.hse.gov.uk/mvr/bodyshop/myths/index.htm

It's like that person who reckons smoking is safe because they have a mate who's uncle smokes for 30years and is apparently fine.

My last post on the matter. My opinion is the forum shouldn't be publishing unsafe advice.

 

[rcx132]

Admins pls don't lock this thread until I've had a chance to substantiate my claims

 

[stumpy1975]

Here you go ime not promoting this its a genuine question as to suitability

 

[stumpy1975]

Here you go ime not prmoting this just a genuine question as to its suitability

 

[rcx132]

[/url][/IMG]

Be aware it's only certain models of their masks that are certified iso safe, and with certain filters fitted, and there are limits and rules that they specify, and as Burdekin states, HSE websites says that "filtered masks are not acceptable" so there's a conflict of information. I think the HSE rules makes them illegal to use commercially but I don't think that applies to DIY use.

I don't think the forum should be deleting threads like this. People can make their own decisions based on the facts. I personally don't like air fed masks, I bought one before I knew about the Sundstrum iso tested mask, if I knew I would probably have gone for the Sunstrum, not just to save money but because of the extra comfort and flexibility.

I'm also not convinced that air fed is that safe. How many people on this forum are using unapproved compressor filters bought on eBay for their air fed masks? Which means they are potentially breathing oil ridden compressor air. I've seen unapproved filters where air leaks arounds the filter element. I've seen unapproved filters that have too little charcoal, or the charcoal is too loose allowing air to pass unfiltered. The HSE website says that a lot of these eBay goods are carrying fake CE approval, and the sellers are offshore and beyond practical legal liability. And how many people are failing to replace their filters because of the £150 cost or because they don't know if their filters have clocked more than the allowed number of used hours? At least with the Sundstrum mask the filters are affordable and you just replace them every X weeks that they specify.

 

[rcx132]

Here you go ime not prmoting this just a genuine question as to its suitability

Hey Stumpy,

I checked that eBay listing. It doesn't say who tested it to be iso safe. It could just be the shops own assumption or bad research. And also it relies on a good seal between your face and the mask. The Sundstrum mask at least I think there is an option for a pumped version (via belt battery pack), so if there are leaks contaminated air would not get in. Your call of course.

 

[stumpy1975]

I have a family and want to be around in years to come so want to do things right

 

[optima21]

I was looking into this recently, but wasn't sure of what type of isocyanate is used in 2 pack paint. I believe the gerson 2k filters are A1B1 filters, and wasnt too sure of the seal of their filters.

looking at scott safety filters they recommend ABEK2 P3 filters for use with methyl isocyanates (think that is the isocyanate used in paint) so I've got their filters.

www.protecdirect.co.uk/medias/sys_master/h46/hfa/8811077369886/pro2000.pdf

so I went for their abek2p3 filters with their aviva half mask.

https://www.scottsafety.com/en/emea/DocumentandMedia1/EMEA_AVIVA40_Flyer_English.pdf

I didn't go for a full mask as I wear glasses and would not be able to get a seal because of that, and these masks are available in small/medium/large sizes and I need a small mask. you can also test the seal when you're wearing it.

I know I'm taking a risk by not having an airfed mask, but like many things in life we make our choices and I'm not trying to turn this into an argument either, so may not make any more replies in this thread.

whatever type of filter is being used, ones of the issues with the isocyanates is that they have no odour and are tasteless so you won't know if they're not being filtered.

 

[stumpy1975]

So guys we have gone a bit of topic valid points regards the mask tho and part and parcel of jspraying but now i need help to set up my cmpressor ive seen water traps/regulators on ebay ime guessing i need one of these and ime guessing i need to control how much air is fed to the gun ? I was thinking of putting a water trap gun end as well

 

[carbon]

A good place to start is http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/air-system.htm

 

[rcx132]

So guys we have gone a bit of topic valid points regards the mask tho and part and parcel of jspraying but now i need help to set up my cmpressor ive seen water traps/regulators on ebay ime guessing i need one of these and ime guessing i need to control how much air is fed to the gun ? I was thinking of putting a water trap gun end as well

Mistakes I made:

1. Bought a cheap regulator/filter. Not only are they awkward to use, they don't trap any water and mine seriously restricted the air flow making my air tools under perform. I think the Metalwork filter/regulator is good value and quality
2. Go straight for a 10mm bore hose, again, anything less and tools loose power.
3. Go for Euro type quick release couplings, not the PCL ones, the Euro couplings are becoming the norm now and they allow more air flow.

Can't think what else you would need.

 

[optima21]

^^^^ as above, I also made a silica gel desiccant dryer in this thread, and that seems to work well

http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/forum/...l-14cfm-3hp-compressor-and-dryer-setup.73079/

 

[rcx132]

^^^^ as above, I also made a silica gel desiccant dryer in this thread, and that seems to work well

http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/forum/...l-14cfm-3hp-compressor-and-dryer-setup.73079/

And I copied