Ford Ranger ABS problems

[dobbslc]

Labour rates are gonna to go thru the roof I think - wages for staff have gotta go up to recruit staff and keep them and labour rates charged out will skyrocket. There just is not enough mechanics/MOT testers/lorry fitters to go round

Not just in the motor trade but most if not all trades!
I'm 8 weeks booking unless it's an emergency. (Electrical)
The plumbing/ heating, building and carpenters, plastering trades are all long waits for a decent one, there is a huge shortage of all skilled workers.
I read an interesting piece a few weeks ago in an electrician magazine that said for every 10 people who left the trade 1 new apprentice was being trained!

I've said this before but the government and education system have been pushing for non hands on skills for decades and this is the result.
Untold amounts of people that can push a mouse around a desk earning peanuts or brew coffee but not enough trades doing the skilled work.
I was one of the last through the traditional electtrical apprenticeship system in the late 80/90's before they virtually stopped training young people.
I think it's started to ramp up again as the bigger companies have finally realised what's coming, well what's already here!
No labour and what they can get is often ****. "Plastic sparkies" are everywhere and I have no doubt it's the same for most trades now.

 

[m_c]

@dobbslc that's only part of the problem. The other problem is trades got seen as what you do if you were educationally challenged.
That was maybe fine 30 years ago, when most trades were relatively straightforward, but if somebody can't manage to pass a few GCSES/Standard grades, do you really think they're suitable for working on complex systems?

In the motor trade it's really not helped by lack of proper licensing, and a trade body who's idea of training, is ticking boxes and multiple choice.
I was probably towards the end of the college courses where you were expected to actually understand the basic systems, and some of the theory behind them.

I got asked to look at some of the coursework and documents for the last apprentices at work, which had been produced by the IMI, and it was horrendous. It was blatantly obvious some parts of it had been written by people who I'd question whether they could actually describe a car, let alone how any part of it worked.

I know when I done my Level 3 EV course, I'm pretty sure anybody semi-competent could pass the online assessment without any prior training.
I did feedback what I thought of the online 'training', as it had some glaring errors in it, but I never heard anything back.

 

[premmington]

@dobbslc that's only part of the problem. The other problem is trades got seen as what you do if you were educationally challenged.
That was maybe fine 30 years ago, when most trades were relatively straightforward, but if somebody can't manage to pass a few GCSES/Standard grades, do you really think they're suitable for working on complex systems?

In the motor trade it's really not helped by lack of proper licensing, and a trade body who's idea of training, is ticking boxes and multiple choice.
I was probably towards the end of the college courses where you were expected to actually understand the basic systems, and some of the theory behind them.

I got asked to look at some of the coursework and documents for the last apprentices at work, which had been produced by the IMI, and it was horrendous. It was blatantly obvious some parts of it had been written by people who I'd question whether they could actually describe a car, let alone how any part of it worked.

I know when I done my Level 3 EV course, I'm pretty sure anybody semi-competent could pass the online assessment without any prior training.
I did feedback what I thought of the online 'training', as it had some glaring errors in it, but I never heard anything back.

IMI and all the other "accredited training bodies" are in reality just businesses selling training.

I did my Level 4 not so long ago - not that I wanted to do it aged 56 - but I needed it for insurance cover.

I agree - what joke that was... (IMI SSC National Occupational Standards).

 

[Ubique]

IMI and all the other "accredited training bodies" are in reality just businesses selling training.

...

The same applies to (most) manufacturer training - the courses have been fragmented into shorter, chargeable sections with a lot of online stuff, now with (my personal hate) 'game based training'. Most of it is training of how to use information systems (workshop information, wiring diagrams, warranty reporting etc.) rather than hands-on repairs.

Partly due to a lot of manufacturers now replacing engines, transmissions, differentials etc. as 'black box units' rather than diagnose & rebuild. It's worrying that as the workshop 'old git' designate, I'm the one that has to deal with stripped threads, broken bolts, seized exhaust sensors and 'non-standard' repairs, not only because the filter-spinners have no clue, but also (based upon them leaving me to it) no interest in learning 'how to'....

 

[premmington]

The same applies to (most) manufacturer training - the courses have been fragmented into shorter, chargeable sections with a lot of online stuff, now with (my personal hate) 'game based training'. Most of it is training of how to use information systems (workshop information, wiring diagrams, warranty reporting etc.) rather than hands-on repairs.

Partly due to a lot of manufacturers now replacing engines, transmissions, differentials etc. as 'black box units' rather than diagnose & rebuild. It's worrying that as the workshop 'old git' designate, I'm the one that has to deal with stripped threads, broken bolts, seized exhaust sensors and 'non-standard' repairs, not only because the filter-spinners have no clue, but also (based upon them leaving me to it) no interest in learning 'how to'....

Truth is: Your quote "Partly due to a lot of manufacturers now replacing engines, transmissions, differentials etc. as 'black box units' rather than diagnose & rebuild."

When you get quoting and charging the labour out - it is more profitable to keep chucking big lumps at cars now.

I done allot of engine building in my time - but no more for me. it just don't pay...

 

[m_c]

@premmington I missed out on getting the Level 4 EV as I was signed off work, and the manager wasn't sure if I'd be back for the available block. Instead he sent the Level 2 tech

@Ubique some of the manufacturer's courses were questionable, but some were good. However I drew the line on the Stellantis online van course during Covid, where there was a session on 'Branding', which consisted of telling you that the different brands had different grilles and logos fitted.

As for complete unit replacements, it's something I've often wondered about. I know Ford warranty was typically the most cost effective repair. But for something like a gearbox, where you need various special tools, multiple shim options, somebody who can actually do the job, how much do Ford actually save by not simply supplying an exchange gearbox?
I know a local Vauxhall dealer were paying the local gearbox repairer to do all their gearbox repairs, as they could turn most around in 24hrs.

Even Ford with the Ecoblue timing belt failures, initially you had to remove the head to inspect for damage before letting Ford make the decision as to what got replaced, but they eventually realised it was easier to simply fit an exchange engine. Less VOR time, less labour, less hassle, and less follow up issues.

 

[premmington]

@premmington I missed out on getting the Level 4 EV as I was signed off work, and the manager wasn't sure if I'd be back for the available block. Instead he sent the Level 2 tech

@Ubique some of the manufacturer's courses were questionable, but some were good. However I drew the line on the Stellantis online van course during Covid, where there was a session on 'Branding', which consisted of telling you that the different brands had different grilles and logos fitted.

As for complete unit replacements, it's something I've often wondered about. I know Ford warranty was typically the most cost effective repair. But for something like a gearbox, where you need various special tools, multiple shim options, somebody who can actually do the job, how much do Ford actually save by not simply supplying an exchange gearbox?
I know a local Vauxhall dealer were paying the local gearbox repairer to do all their gearbox repairs, as they could turn most around in 24hrs.

Even Ford with the Ecoblue timing belt failures, initially you had to remove the head to inspect for damage before letting Ford make the decision as to what got replaced, but they eventually realised it was easier to simply fit an exchange engine. Less VOR time, less labour, less hassle, and less follow up issues.

You did not miss much mate...

 

[northwest]

I done allot of engine building in my time - but no more for me. it just don't pay...

This is just an outrageous situation to be in. Recycle my ass! Actively create landfill, makes my bloody head hurt. I started rebuilding engines and gearboxes when I was sixteen, the idea of just going out and buying a replacement engine was fantasy money for me, rebuilding what I had, much more realistic a proposition. I can see that porting and polishing a cylinder head would be totally out of the question nowadays.

 

[Ubique]

@premmington I missed out on getting the Level 4 EV as I was signed off work, and the manager wasn't sure if I'd be back for the available block. Instead he sent the Level 2 tech

@Ubique some of the manufacturer's courses were questionable, but some were good. However I drew the line on the Stellantis online van course during Covid, where there was a session on 'Branding', which consisted of telling you that the different brands had different grilles and logos fitted.

As for complete unit replacements, it's something I've often wondered about. I know Ford warranty was typically the most cost effective repair. But for something like a gearbox, where you need various special tools, multiple shim options, somebody who can actually do the job, how much do Ford actually save by not simply supplying an exchange gearbox?
I know a local Vauxhall dealer were paying the local gearbox repairer to do all their gearbox repairs, as they could turn most around in 24hrs.

Even Ford with the Ecoblue timing belt failures, initially you had to remove the head to inspect for damage before letting Ford make the decision as to what got replaced, but they eventually realised it was easier to simply fit an exchange engine. Less VOR time, less labour, less hassle, and less follow up issues.

I worked for a Ford dealer at that time, also the issue with taking test drive measurements for the powershift... (un)fortunately I was one of the tech's in a workshop of 26 that were 'qualified' to carry out the powershift repairs, the warranty write-up took almost as long as the repairs... I've still got the phone numbers for pre-auth. stored in my phone!

 

[premmington]

This is just an outrageous situation to be in. Recycle my ass! Actively create landfill, makes my bloody head hurt. I started rebuilding engines and gearboxes when I was sixteen, the idea of just going out and buying a replacement engine was fantasy money for me, rebuilding what I had, much more realistic a proposition. I can see that porting and polishing a cylinder head would be totally out of the question nowadays.

There are allot of parts/bits in a modern engine - hundreds of pounds of new gaskets and bolts - days of labour. Chucking lumps in things is the way forward.

 

[m_c]

There are allot of parts/bits in a modern engine - hundreds of pounds of new gaskets and bolts - days of labour. Chucking lumps in things is the way forward.

I agree.
You also have to consider that vehicle is taking up space. The head/block needs to go elsewhere to be machined. Then there is always something you forget/didn't realise you had to order.
Even if it's an engine that you know well and you can get any machining done quickly, that vehicle will very likely be there for at least a week.
Fit a recon engine, and it'll most likely be in and out in a day or two, and overall cost is probably not much different.

A good example is I know one local dealer who had one ramp dedicated for major (aka gearbox/engine) van repairs.
If they had any issues getting the parts for the van once it was stripped, that ramp was blocked until they got the parts.
If you booked a van in for major warranty work, they simply parked it in the yard until it made it onto that one ramp, which could be weeks, as they simply couldn't afford to have more than one large ramp blocked.

 

[premmington]

I agree.
You also have to consider that vehicle is taking up space. The head/block needs to go elsewhere to be machined. Then there is always something you forget/didn't realise you had to order.
Even if it's an engine that you know well and you can get any machining done quickly, that vehicle will very likely be there for at least a week.
Fit a recon engine, and it'll most likely be in and out in a day or two, and overall cost is probably not much different.

A good example is I know one local dealer who had one ramp dedicated for major (aka gearbox/engine) van repairs.
If they had any issues getting the parts for the van once it was stripped, that ramp was blocked until they got the parts.
If you booked a van in for major warranty work, they simply parked it in the yard until it made it onto that one ramp, which could be weeks, as they simply couldn't afford to have more than one large ramp blocked.

I just had an engine out and a head off a crafter van - I done it bit by bit late afternoons - it is is extra money - but for me to stop what I am doing and not doing anything else - I would have lost money doing it.

 

[northwest]

There are allot of parts/bits in a modern engine - hundreds of pounds of new gaskets and bolts - days of labour. Chucking lumps in things is the way forward.

The last major engine rebuild I did was a Saab 2.3 CDS and that was a bit of a nightmare and a real wake up call. This was back in 1994 so god only knows the complexity and cost of a modern lump. Tolerances were likely beyond the understanding of your modern spanner monkey and some of the parts as you say were very expensive.
Bring back the Ford Pinto I say.

 

[addjunkie]

Bring back the Ford Pinto I say.

Though I appreciate the advances in automotive engineering, it amazes me how we ever managed with out all these fancy sensors, over complex wiring or super sensitive over complex over engineered engines and gear boxes.

They may be better from a to b, but not exactly green just binning big chunks. Or the whole car because one bit is so expensive.

 

[Bornfree]

This is just an outrageous situation to be in. Recycle my ass! Actively create landfill, makes my bloody head hurt. I started rebuilding engines and gearboxes when I was sixteen, the idea of just going out and buying a replacement engine was fantasy money for me, rebuilding what I had, much more realistic a proposition. I can see that porting and polishing a cylinder head would be totally out of the question nowadays.

It's becoming a problem finding engine machine shops now. The place in Norwich I've used for 40 years no longer do any bottom end work just head's.

 

[northwest]

It's becoming a problem finding engine machine shops now. The place in Norwich I've used for 40 years no longer do any bottom end work just head's.

I used Teesside Motor Factors for many years, the place is a car park now I believe, all that knowledge now gone forever. You could go in and the parts guy would know which pistons were for what and what you could substitute and what you could use if you were altering the stroke and so on and so on, try that now with some of these parts monkeys, without a reg number they cannot even sort out a sidelight bulb!

 

[Smallfry]

It's becoming a problem finding engine machine shops now. The place in Norwich I've used for 40 years no longer do any bottom end work just head's.

Its the same down here in Kent. Was two really good places. One of them used to do engine balancing too. All gone now.

 

[Smouser]

Thanks all for the insight into the general motor garage/car mechanic trade/training, interesting reading.

On another note, I drove the Ranger to Southampton and back today (~70 miles total) and all is well with the Ranger and its ABS.

Thank goodness.

I will post back when I get another ABS issue, I bet it will be in less than a year

 

[Migmac]

Thanks all for the insight into the general motor garage/car mechanic trade/training, interesting reading.

On another note, I drove the Ranger to Southampton and back today (~70 miles total) and all is well with the Ranger and its ABS.

Thank goodness.

I will post back when I get another ABS issue, I bet it will be in less than a year

Hope that’s the only fault you get.

 

[timmy123]

Hi @Smouser , Interesting thread about the abs fault , Its been very helpful today, Where did you manage to get a wiring diagram from ? Iv been looking online but no luck Thanks