Isocyanate free 2k paint

[the snooper]

that's terrible its staying soft for over 4 weeks and something so light as masking tape ruins the finish not looking like great paint

 

[burrows1980]

Yep!! I know good results can be had of this stuff, but blimey its getting a bit to time consuming to try and get the perfect results! Just wish it was as easy as the Lechler Epoxy primer im using! Wouldnt mind but Ive just bought a new batch of it so kinda got to keep plodding on now!

Will update again at some point.

Gaz

 

[vw1]

I brought some 2k satin black iso free from jawel paints for my chassis parts on my beetle resto and not had chance to use it yet. I have been keeping an eye on your thread but am not sure I can be bothered with all the hard work..
I think I may stay with using a paint brush ...

 

[marlinspike]

I have a Gerson mask and they reckon they are OK for a total of 36 hours with 2k, as long as they are returned to the sealed bag between uses. I haven't tried it with 2k so no idea how effective it is, but it works well with primers and cellulose aerosols.

I always look up the safety sheet for commercial paints if I can.
.

 

[burrows1980]

I tried a gerson mask when I sprayed a comparison piece of steel to see how different non ISO is to normal hardener. It was a small section, but didn't feel any ill effects. Don't think I'd like to try a full respray with one in a 6 x 3m garage, with no extraction etc.

 

[old yellar]

I have to say lad, if I was having that much trouble with a paint I would stop using it.it just seems to be a different product to the one I used.maybe they have changed something in it? I would be very wary of continuing the job with it if its that week cos it wont stand up to much when on the road.after 4 weeks it should be fully hard and cured and be well able to stand up to masking tape.if its not then its not worth using.

 

[burrows1980]

It's looking that way mate, already looking for a different type of paint, considering celly again. Just waiting to see how the inside hardens final decision time then, but I am worried about using it on the outer panels!!

Very annoying really, would have been a good paint for home use if it hardened, still believe it needs to be applied lightly, and left a hour or so before next coat, not ideal and finish will be compromised in my view.

I've got around 3ltrs of the ud429 now, even if I don't use it on the car now, I'll still have a play around with it, see if I can get somewhere with it.

Gaz

 

[Daz1968]

I used solvent base and upol 1k smart clear on a few parts that have held up ok but it isn't a daily drive, since I have invested in airfed but would still use 1k on small items or interior parts, it does dry quite hard and masking tape defo doesn't effect it. Only downside is the smell carries further than 2k but not really any different to cellulose in this respect

 

[burrows1980]

Weird thing about the tape is, when its first applied and removed doesn't effect the paint at all, but if it's left for a few days that's when it makes the paint.

I've used solvent base and upol 1k clear, results were ace but because I was doing a large area, when applying the clear it was like I was in a cloud, if i was using it again on large items id definetly consider rigging up extraction fan or something.

Gaz

 

[Daz1968]

I only used the unibinder in primer but found anything other than a mist coat of solvent base caused it to soften and did get fed up with it in the end, i ended up with high build epoxy primer as my compressor can't keep up with a full sized gun and airfed so I only use 2k with a devilbiss sri pro for top coat gloss or clear. I am not experienced however as only painted the one full car and a few small repairs, but hoping to get better in future.

 

[burrows1980]

I only used the unibinder in primer but found anything other than a mist coat of solvent base caused it to soften and did get fed up with it in the end, i ended up with high build epoxy primer as my compressor can't keep up with a full sized gun and airfed so I only use 2k with a devilbiss sri pro for top coat gloss or clear. I am not experienced however as only painted the one full car and a few small repairs, but hoping to get better in future.

Ive got the same comp as you Daz I think, Clark SE16c100? Does the sri pro and air fed work well, or is it a lot of stop start? All my panels are off the car so doing in stages. Ive got a Pro Lite, the HVLP air cap works fine with the compressor, but I suppose if I did the whole car in one hit maybe it would struggle. I have got the other air caps TE10 & TE20 as well..

I got home tonight and checked on a experiment i started last night. Between 6 to 8 weeks ago I sprayed one half of my sump guard in non iso and the other half in proper hardener 2k. Last night I stuck a piece of masking tape lightly onto both halves of the guard, and the non iso side when peeled off left the imprint of the tape while the normal 2k side was perfectly untouched... Then I noticed the tops of the strut towers in the engine bay had a dimpled effect, realising Id placed a car cover loosely across the front the other day, just the slightest amount of pressure had caused the texture of the car cover to leave its mark in the paint, and this is over 4 weeks old!

So based on this im going to be leaving the Non iso paint alone now, had high hopes for it but unfortunetly its too problematic.

Gaz

 

[Daz1968]

Mine is sri pro so only the mini gun less than 3cfm on conventional aircap, it keeps up but works hard running about 50-60% of time so air gradually gets hotter and more water in filter, never had anything get through to spraygun or mask but that's down to coalescing filter I think. Don't think a full sized pro lite would stand a chance. Think you need a second compressor if a panel at a time though you would be surprised how good the sri pro is

 

[burrows1980]

Mine is sri pro so only the mini gun less than 3cfm on conventional aircap, it keeps up but works hard running about 50-60% of time so air gradually gets hotter and more water in filter, never had anything get through to spraygun or mask but that's down to coalescing filter I think. Don't think a full sized pro lite would stand a chance. Think you need a second compressor if a panel at a time though you would be surprised how good the sri pro is

Will have a look into the SRi gun. Ive got 40m of copper pipe runing round the garage, with rad drain valves at every drop, ive never had any water in the last two valves so hopefully doing its job.. Cheers for the info Daz

 

[Daz1968]

Compressor should be about 9cfm fad so with mask about 6cfm min I just get away with it. Not ideal but can't really run to another compressor for how much I would use it, smaller gun also results in less overspray so it suits my needs, may not be for everyone though

 

[marlinspike]

There is an interesting current thread on Detailing World where one of the pro sprayers is getting good results with direct gloss with 2k clear coat on top:

http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=360343

Could it be the brand of direct gloss you are using, Burrows?

On another point, I could have sworn I posted my earlier comment about Gerson masks as a reply to someone's query, but that now seems to have disappeared.

 

[Rocketman]

Marlinspike I think most people who know the dangers of iso paints wouldn't want to risk a non-airfed mask of any sort. You only need some movement of your face and the seal is compromised.

 

[marlinspike]

I agree Rocketman; I don't think I would want to spray 2k at home even though the Gerson masks claim adequate protection, as it's also about your neighbours health, extraction and so on. I bought the Gerson mask because I use craft paint aerosols a lot, which stink, plus primer and non iso paints on my resto project, other sprays etc. and it seemed better value to buy a decent mask and use it for everything.

The craft aerosols, Rustoleum I think, don't seem to even recommend the use of a mask on the tin, yet I can smell them for ages afterwards and I do all my spraying outside in the open.

 

[droopsnoot]

So based on this im going to be leaving the Non iso paint alone now, had high hopes for it but unfortunetly its too problematic.

Thanks for the updates. I'm getting closer to painting my car, and as it's a very dark colour I was hoping this might be a solution, so I'm very grateful to you for documenting the experience. I think I'll go with celly (or a modern 1k version that a local supplier does) as I also have issued with neighbours and I'm too worried that my repairs might show through to risk paying someone to put top coat on for me.

 

[Daz1968]

I found as long as filtered extraction for paint mist the 2k paint as it doesn't dry by solvent evaporation was actually less smelly than any 1k paint including aerosol,

 

[BillJ]

Reviving this thread once again, I recently used the Jawel iso-free lacquer when painting a new wing. I used it over Lechler Hydrofan water-based basecoat that I have used before with a 1K lacquer but never with 2K or with the Jawel stuff.

I mixed it exactly to the instructions but thinned it to the recommendations from the Valspar uni-binder data-sheet. It went on really nicely and flowed to a good finish and once touch-dry I put it away for a few days. After that, however, it still hadn't become hard enough to go on the front LHS of a car that was going to navigate our local single-track roads with some aggressive hedges. So I left it a bit longer, and longer...

After a good few weeks it still didn't seem fully hard and I could mark it with a thumbnail. Then I remembered reading here (or in some other thread?) about flatting it down to break the surface and help the air-drying process. I did that last weekend using 800 grit wet and it flatted down very nicely. I decided to leave any further sanding and polishing until it was hard so I put it in the conservatory and the next evening went to have a look. The conservatory had got quite hot, as it often does, and the lacquer was shiny again! It had obviously flowed slightly in the heat and now displays a really nice finish but I'm still not happy that it is hard enough.

I think I'll just have to fit the wing now as I'm fed up with driving an accident-damaged car, even if it wasn't my fault. I'll just try to keep it away from the hedges.