Loan or hire, has anyone got a proper valve seat cutting set?

[arther dailey]

Hi
want to re cut the valve seats on my L200, yes I am going to get a quote from machine shop, but as I like doing my own work wondered if any one on here has a set of cutters and guides(6mm) that I could loan/hire , a few seats are pitted to low to lap in, although actual valves cleaned up ok on the seats.
hope this alright to ask in this column Mods ,as its not a sale or wanted , although I wouldnt mind buying a set I think most who have them will not be selling.
otherwise are the neway make a good quality tool? not my first rodeo on engines , just not had the need to re cut seats before.(three angles)
cheers guys

 

[graffian]

Lot's of people who turn out realy good engines use the neway cutters, so I am assuming they are good.

I have a black n decker grinder but it's all pretty worn and I doubt I have any tiny pilots. No it's not for sale.
I would be wary of buying a grinder unless you see it used and can check the seats it makes are OK.

The Cylinder head shop prices weren't crazy and they did a good job.

 

[tom2207]

Cutters dont work as well as they used to as the inserts are very hard these days ,

 

[Ruffian]

Lot's of people who turn out realy good engines use the neway cutters, so I am assuming they are good.

I have a black n decker grinder but it's all pretty worn and I doubt I have any tiny pilots. No it's not for sale.
I would be wary of buying a grinder unless you see it used and can check the seats it makes are OK.

The Cylinder head shop prices weren't crazy and they did a good job.

The neway cutters are excellent but circa £500 for a small kit.
Work awesome. Used one to recut seats on a perkins head a few months back.

But for a one off job would just send to machine shop.

 

[frank horton]

quite a lot of engines have the super hard seats now.....well petrol engines anyway.......
is ur's petrol ???? if so a machine shop will be needed.......
the HSS cutters of old wont really do the job.....and the Black and Decker STONE type, I havn't seen in years.....
can u still buy the stones.....????
the French machine SERTI is the machine of choice now.......does a brill job but the machine costs £20,000.....
the valves dont need lapping in once done by the Serti......

 

[Ruffian]

quite a lot of engines have the super hard seats now.....well petrol engines anyway.......
is ur's petrol ???? if so a machine shop will be needed.......
the HSS cutters of old wont really do the job.....and the Black and Decker STONE type, I havn't seen in years.....
can u still buy the stones.....????
the French machine SERTI is the machine of choice now.......does a brill job but the machine costs £20,000.....
the valves dont need lapping in once done by the Serti......

The l200 is more than likely diesel,
And they use carbide cutters on the neway cutters.

 

[arther dailey]

yup diesel , I sent it to machine shop , collected , valves had beenn dropped in, due to social distancing I picked it up as was , checked it out at home with a eye glass(jewelers) the inlets all but one fine, the od one having a pit that v.nearly coverd the width of seat, how ever upon checking the exhausts, OMG, I couldnt believe it, so much so I even got my brother to double check (retired detail bench fitter) and yes he agreed , looks like a light skim one side but has missed the other side ? so all the exhausts are cut at the wrong angle compared to stem it seems ? how you could do this I am not sure , but brother suggests cutter in a mill and wrong angle set, no guide used ...well I was a little bit miffed , it might just be a diesel truck , but I wouldnt re assemble that on any darn engine.not even a old lawn mower.
Phoned the guy , I kept my patiance and was polite as we all have bad days right , he wasnt suprised at all it seems ,(he knew) ah well if I cut them deeper you will end up with a wider seat...bring it back .
Hmmmm, even though I havent done them always thought you have three cutters , angles, In, seat (about 45dg) and throat, without looking up spec the other two are about 30/70. I thought when you re cut seat its some times needed to re cut others to maintain correct seat width.
hence the question on here , looks like I might phone another firm and see if they will do it as loathed to give it back to some one prepared to pass off work (I use that word loosley) of that standard.

 

[CompoSimmonite]

For unleaded / hardened seats they need to be machine cut as the traditional hand cutters (I've still got a set for A Series engines) won't do the job. You then need to use brand new valves as they aren't then lapped in but rather the valve and machine cut seat will be a perfect match.

 

[brightspark]

I just took my head in and had the seats and valves ground job done .

 

[graffian]

The stones are still available from Goodsons in the states.
You can get stones to cut every seat material.

The serdi/sunnen/quikway cutters I have seen do all three angles
with the one[expensive] cutter.
The machines can chatter and cut eccentric seats.
If you see a machine it doesn't look like you can cut a ****** seat, the
pilots are carbide and a tight fit in the guide[hopefully]. The drive has some
flex so it doesn't push the cutter off the guide axis.

I was looking at neway cutters, for the one bike it woudl have been something like
£130. But that was close to the max size on the cutter and sods law the next
head woudl want a couple of larger cutters.

 

[CompoSimmonite]

yup diesel , I sent it to machine shop , collected , valves had beenn dropped in, due to social distancing I picked it up as was , checked it out at home with a eye glass(jewelers) the inlets all but one fine, the od one having a pit that v.nearly coverd the width of seat, how ever upon checking the exhausts, OMG, I couldnt believe it, so much so I even got my brother to double check (retired detail bench fitter) and yes he agreed , looks like a light skim one side but has missed the other side ? so all the exhausts are cut at the wrong angle compared to stem it seems ? how you could do this I am not sure , but brother suggests cutter in a mill and wrong angle set, no guide used ...well I was a little bit miffed , it might just be a diesel truck , but I wouldnt re assemble that on any darn engine.not even a old lawn mower.
Phoned the guy , I kept my patiance and was polite as we all have bad days right , he wasnt suprised at all it seems ,(he knew) ah well if I cut them deeper you will end up with a wider seat...bring it back .
Hmmmm, even though I havent done them always thought you have three cutters , angles, In, seat (about 45dg) and throat, without looking up spec the other two are about 30/70. I thought when you re cut seat its some times needed to re cut others to maintain correct seat width.
hence the question on here , looks like I might phone another firm and see if they will do it as loathed to give it back to some one prepared to pass off work (I use that word loosley) of that standard.

Might need new valve seats fitting if that badly pitted. You can get reconditioned heads with new seats and valves ready to fit which might be worth considering.

 

[Stueeee]

quite a lot of engines have the super hard seats now.....well petrol engines anyway.......
is ur's petrol ???? if so a machine shop will be needed.......
the HSS cutters of old wont really do the job.....and the Black and Decker STONE type, I havn't seen in years.....
can u still buy the stones.....????
the French machine SERTI is the machine of choice now.......does a brill job but the machine costs £20,000.....
the valves dont need lapping in once done by the Serti......

Black and Decker Vibro Centric Valve seat grinder bits are still available from these people.
https://www.cylinderheadsupply.com/valve-seat-grinding-seat-grinding-stones-black---decker.html
If the stone is dressed with the B & D diamond tool before doing the seats they don't need doing with grinding paste as long as the valves are good. the B & D Valve Facing machine is pretty good, even better if the B & D spring collets are replaced with an ER 20 spindle and chuck as on this one,

 

[Melvyn Best]

I have a Neway valve seat cutter set but no 6mm guide and only 45 degree cutters , hate to think of the cost of the cutters for 3 way seats, mine cost enough 3 odd years ago. They will, with care, cut unleaded seats but I still lap valves in to be sure of a good seat

 

[graffian]

f the stone is dressed with the B & D diamond tool before doing the seats they don't need doing with grinding paste as long as the valves are good.

That ginder is pretty;-) Got some pics of the spindle?
I always had intentions of making a centreless holder to replace the Crawfords unavailable collets in mine.

 

[arther dailey]

Black and Decker Vibro Centric Valve seat grinder bits are still available from these people.
https://www.cylinderheadsupply.com/valve-seat-grinding-seat-grinding-stones-black---decker.html
If the stone is dressed with the B & D diamond tool before doing the seats they don't need doing with grinding paste as long as the valves are good. the B & D Valve Facing machine is pretty good, even better if the B & D spring collets are replaced with an ER 20 spindle and chuck as on this one,

looks like you have done a few seats along the way ! nice machine

 

[arther dailey]

Might need new valve seats fitting if that badly pitted. You can get reconditioned heads with new seats and valves ready to fit which might be worth considering.

you can get replacement heads , but it seems some are made like cheese, so prefer to use a good original and refurb it , new seats if needed,skim/pressure test etc .

 

[arther dailey]

I just took my head in and had the seats and valves ground job done .

I already did that...

 

[Dcal]

What size are your seats?
I've picked up a few Neways over the years
You might get lucky, but most are smaller sizes.

 

[8ob]

As @tom2207 says the stoning in of seats is not as easy with modern seats, still doable but you will need a very gentle touch and re dress the stone quite often.

Bob

 

[Migmac]

For a K74? £220 for a bare head from Milners