I buy Facom, not because I believe them to be better than Snap-On, it is because no such truck ever existed anywhere near me. The warranty has changed for the worse over the years, certainly since they were taken over as reported by others. I have had screwdrivers lose their tip through work hardening, striking tools such as pin punches shear, ratchets that no longer ratcheted, all swapped or in the case of the ratchets a new head kit handed to me. The quality of their keys is exceptional and easily compares to specialists like Wiha or Wera.
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Ubique
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The older Facom stuff is great - much like the older Britool (also acquired by Stanley Black & Decker) A lot of Facom stuff is now made outside of France, which is the 'less great' stuff. Get the stuff made in France and it'll be very good quality. MAC tool vans are the Facom outlet / warranty exchange, but unlike Snap On (which I own very little of - the cost / quality equation always seemed to be off compared to other brands) they do have Internet and 'bricks & mortar' outlets that will happily deal with warranty exchanges, albeit with a delay compared to the vans.
Maker
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Surely that's not a typical mechanic's monthly spend?
hotponyshoes
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Surely that's not a typical mechanic's monthly spend?
A van that goes into a dealers (ie, 8-10 mechanics working there can easily do that from the lads. Plus the same again (or more) from the garage itself just on diagnostic software updates!
Kram
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Quality in metal can be measured. Snapon use the same grade of CR-V steel as every other reputable brand, and there are plenty that are suitable for professional use.
hotponyshoes
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If you use the tools everyday to make a living you'll probably be buying tools regularly as well.
Along with diagnostic software and the like.
You don't need to spend a lot to get the snap-on (or Mac/whoever) van to stop in every week.
That's worth a few quid just to have stuff brought to the door and save you time buying on the internet or trotting off to halfords for shopping/warranty claims etc.
Along with diagnostic software and the like.
You don't need to spend a lot to get the snap-on (or Mac/whoever) van to stop in every week.
That's worth a few quid just to have stuff brought to the door and save you time buying on the internet or trotting off to halfords for shopping/warranty claims etc.
the guy Im working for at the moment easily spends that ,,, and thats to keep a workshop of three men in tools ,,, in the last few months we have had no breakages and no warranty claims , but the need for new stuff is never ending , if you do something like egr coolers etc you can easily have five ratchets on the go at once , 1/4 and 3/8 , long short and flexi head , as well as long ratchet spanners , and aviation spanners ,, its crazy how many hand tools it takes to work on modern stuff , what Im finding now is that the tools are getting longer and your working more right at the end of your reach , with that in mind magnetic sockets become a must have , etc etc etcSurely that's not a typical mechanic's monthly spend?
yep , but its the warranty that your buying , Thursday afternoon the guy arrives , swaps out broken stuff , and you get what you need to keep you going , as long as you dont loose the stuff or drivers etc dont '' borrow '' it all the time it works out grand ,,, at 80 or 90 quid an hour a two hour trip to get a socket or swap a spanner becomes expensive.
hotponyshoes
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Also there are lots of mechanics that claim tax back on the costs of tools.
The snap-on guys normally tell them how to offset the cost of finance on the new tool box..
I've even seen tool sellers printing out p87's for guys pre-filled with that years spend..
The snap-on guys normally tell them how to offset the cost of finance on the new tool box..
I've even seen tool sellers printing out p87's for guys pre-filled with that years spend..
Kram
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Were not talking about fancy, rare or unusual kit here, just plain 3/8" drive hex bits. I'd expect a professional to have a spare set.
This thread is in the context of buying used ones off ebay to make up and maintain a set - as if they are somehow superior to every other brand, as in them not needing a warranty because they are better. Nope.
This thread is in the context of buying used ones off ebay to make up and maintain a set - as if they are somehow superior to every other brand, as in them not needing a warranty because they are better. Nope.
Brad93
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Kram, you've never bought a quality tool I'd dare to say, if you have you haven't shown it here.
How can you begin to compare chinese sockets with high end european/usa made sockets, because "they use the same metal".
Thats like saying a chinese lathe and an english lathe are comparable because they're both made of cast iron.
It's clear from what you post that you like to buy cheaper tools, and adapt them to suit etc.
That's fine. Perfectly acceptable and really quite interesting seeing them put to use.
However, unless you are in the trade, you'll have no idea what using a tool dozens of times a day even feels like, let alone the experience of how a tool holds up.
How can you begin to compare chinese sockets with high end european/usa made sockets, because "they use the same metal".
Thats like saying a chinese lathe and an english lathe are comparable because they're both made of cast iron.
It's clear from what you post that you like to buy cheaper tools, and adapt them to suit etc.
That's fine. Perfectly acceptable and really quite interesting seeing them put to use.
However, unless you are in the trade, you'll have no idea what using a tool dozens of times a day even feels like, let alone the experience of how a tool holds up.
Maker
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That's not so bad I suppose, I thought you were suggesting one man would be spending half his take home pay on tools.
Ubique
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I have socket sets of various brands, Britool, Facom etc. that are older than my kids - one is in his 30's I don't know of any tech. who has a 'spare set', maybe a smaller set at home, but no spares, we just have to look after the (expensive) tools we have.
Ubique
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I still have King Dick!
Brad93
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A lot of my whitworth spanners are King Dick. Quality british stuff.
Snail brand, super slim and britool are all good stuff.
Trevorleach
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More like a third of his wages, mechs wages are not bad these days.
Kram
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I said reputable brands, not the million unknown chinese ones. Plenty of other decent brands.
Anyway, yes they use the same metal, the same grade, thats why there are standard grades of metal.
I do have several expensive lathe tools and Mitutoyo items that would be hard to beat, a bit over the top for a hobby lathe. Bison chuck, carbide bars, 0.002mm indicators. Lots of decent branded inserts, although many packs of chinese too, both have a purpose.
My 2511 chainsaw that I am using every day, hard to beat that. Its not the most expensive and many have their own preference, but its lighter and the expensive battery ones cant get close on weight.
Chinese vs English lathe is a bit silly comparason considering British industry has made sod all since the 70's. Theres only a handful of rare small metric british lathes that dont have a screw on chuck, flat ways etc.. Chinese fit perfectly in my space.
People warned me of chinese lathes, and while its not perfect, it has not noticably worn the ways or anything else, its near the same as the day I got it apart from my modifications. You have likely seen I have done some stuff on it that its not intended for..
Your telling me you have never lost a 10mm socket or that the job has had to wait until it was found?
Small tools have a habbit of getting misplaced atleast for my stuff. I tend to have a garage, car and shed set of spanners, sockets and bits, I find it very useful. (Garage and car are a reasonable distance from house..)
I lost one half inch tipco combination spanner ,,, thirty years ago , I have never lost anything since [ that I know of ] and I can say that in sincerity ,, Ive lent things to people who havnt returned said item , but thats been a donation not a loss , Ive scrapped things , and put things away not to be used , Ive worn things out and modified things beyond only one specific use , but Ive only ever lost one spanner ,,, and I actually know where it went I just couldnt get it back ,,, spares lol I have spares of spares and back ups to the spares ,,, but I pay for my stuff with hard earned and I simply dont loose things , Im sure Im not on my own.
Ubique
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Nope - neither have any of the techs above 'service' (aka filter-spinners) level I've worked with over the years - filter-spinners tend to accept carelessness with tools as acceptable collateral damage in their quest for hitting bonus, the rest of us have developed working processes that are less 'scattergun' so tools are not spread around in an arc roughly equivalent to an arms span. Yes, they get dropped, but also retrieved at that point - it's just of of those things that become habitual, especially if you have a grounding in working mobile.
Tools (of any type) have a different value if you earn your living with them rather than as a function of a hobby or interest, consequently they have a greater importance that what you are working on. If I were in a position of 'sacrifice the tool or the part', it'd be the part every time.
