Welding Solids?

[Justme]

Why not fit the solid to the other part & weld the tube to the tube?

Or use tube for both parts but supply a solid sleeve to fit inside the smaller of the two tubes to stop crushing. You could weld it in to stop them leaving it out to save weight if its critical for the strength.

Or fit sleeves (fixed or loose) as the cheapest & lightest method.

 

[Rick]

I started at 1650 - I'm down to 1400 fully fuelled up - I'd like to get down to 1200 kgs



You don't need to worry about weight with 600 bhp!!! when you have 240 bhp and 1400 kgs and you can't get any more bhp every kg counts

haha, well its not slow, but its always nice to go quicker! Its handling and braking where i need help as well

I want to get to 750kgs 750hp ideally. Be an awesome power to weight.

Why not fit the solid to the other part & weld the tube to the tube?

Or use tube for both parts but supply a solid sleeve to fit inside the smaller of the two tubes to stop crushing. You could weld it in to stop them leaving it out to save weight if its critical for the strength.

Or fit sleeves (fixed or loose) as the cheapest & lightest method.

Agree'd safety is important.

 

[hotrodder]

Probably already aware of these but some of the common commercial designs for bolted cage bars here. More versatile regarding cage assembly, welding is far more straight forward and less prone to distortion but more machining involved...

I spent hours removing underseal, bits of wiring, cutting down all the bolts so theres no "overhang" to save less than 0.5kg.

Obviously not that obsessed then although well on the way . Time to seek help when you start drilling out the centre (i.e. hollow out) of non-critical fastners (all those grams add up), attacking inner door frames with a holesaw and, well, swish cheesing anything that's non structural

 

[Rick]

Probably already aware of these but some of the common commercial designs for bolted cage bars here. More versatile regarding cage assembly, welding is far more straight forward and less prone to distortion but more machining involved...



Obviously not that obsessed then although well on the way . Time to seek help when you start drilling out the centre (i.e. hollow out) of non-critical fastners (all those grams add up), attacking inner door frames with a holesaw and, well, swish cheesing anything that's non structural

haha, that would be too far, drilling the centers out of the Ti fastners

What inner door frames? Its only a single skin

 

[cookie munsta]

Type of steel also important, you will need to heat the solid up to may be 50 degree celcius to reduce hot short, under bead cracking. you may not need to worry about it, but do it right the first time and you won't need to worry about it again. do a couple of practice runs cause it may not be easy to get it right the first time if you don't weld much and i would suggest low hydrogen rods 2.5 E7018 @ 70- 100 amps favour the solid but you will work that out in practice runs. good tacks. good luck.

 

[Dragonetti]

welding solids

Hi,↲
it lo6ks like most of your questions have been answered here, but I would just like to add the following:-↲
I wouldn't recommend pre heating the end of the rod as this will leave the metal unstable and liable to bending or fracture. If you want to go this way then heat thd whole length of rod to white heat and then quench it in water or used motor oil. Reheat to a cherry red, then weld it and allow to air cool. This way the whole rod is hardened and tempered.↲
MMA (stick) welding is stronger than mig/tig and (with a little practice) is just as aesthetically pleasing to the ey.↲
Regardz ↲
Ron

 

[Ragnarok]

just been reading through this post, and i agree with the rest of the responses weight is important, Very, and you'd be better off replacing that solid with a tube, drill the holes and weld in sleeves for the bolts to go through, that way the tube/tubes won't be crushed you'll probably get more strength considering that you are welding a huge heat sink to a thin wall tube, not to mention being easier to weld, and you'll lose about 0.5kg you say sounds good all round to me.

Rune.

 

[hotrodder]

Hi,↲
it lo6ks like most of your questions have been answered here, but I would just like to add the following:-↲
I wouldn't recommend pre heating the end of the rod as this will leave the metal unstable and liable to bending or fracture. If you want to go this way then heat thd whole length of rod to white heat and then quench it in water or used motor oil. Reheat to a cherry red, then weld it and allow to air cool. This way the whole rod is hardened and tempered.↲
MMA (stick) welding is stronger than mig/tig and (with a little practice) is just as aesthetically pleasing to the ey.↲
Regardz ↲
Ron

The last thing you want in a roll cage is quenched and tempered material. Most cage materials don't contain enough carbon to be hardenable anyway but in the case of top fuel chassis... didn't go to well when some of the teams decided to have a play with quenched and tempered 4130 instead of normalised tube

 

[Tino]

MMA (stick) welding is stronger than mig/tig and (with a little practice) is just as aesthetically pleasing to the ey.↲
Regardz ↲
Ron

Simply stating that MMA is stronger than MIG/TIG is nonsense. The strength of a weld depends on far to many different parameters to single out one process. Each process has its place and if done properly will give the best/strongest weld for the given application.

 

[Dragonetti]

welding solids

Hi everyone,

I am a final year student, doing automotive engineering at coventry university.

In one of our courseworks, we have to design a bracket for roll cages (for a big company which i cannot state for confidential reasons)

We have designed the bracket/attachment, but have come into a dilemna.

There is a tube just say going one direction, then perpendicular (90 degree's) to it, is a rod, now we want to attach this rod by welding, but we have heard that it is hard to weld a solid, so what techniques are used to weld this type? or is it not feasible? due to being a solid not hollow?

Someone also said there might be a technique of heating up the solid to a pre-assigned temperature, and then welded? any truth behind this?

Sorry for all the questions, but myself and group mates are new to welding, so have very limited knowledge.


Any help is welcome, links, articles, journals etc

thank you in advance

Suraj

I have put the original thread in here for the benifit of those who seem to have forgoten what the question was, in the first place.
WELDING SOLIDS
We all know (I hope) that it would be bettter to change the rod for a tube, suitably drilled and bushed for any bolts etc.... but that wasn't what was being asked.Welding a solid rod to a tube you have a whole set of welding differentials and their associated problems to consider.
All I have done here is to offer one technique tn achieve this, without going into a long diatribe on the subject.

With regard to my comment regarding MMA & mig. My apologies for letting my personal predjudices slip out. Of course, they both have their uses. As always it's horses for courses↲

Ron

 

[suj]

Update

Hi Guys,

sorry for a late reply, myself and fellow group members would like to first thank every single one of you, we have taken into account all your advice, and we have submitted our final assignment (with a presentation infront of the "big company" who were very pleased with our presentation, poster and Q&A that we answered)

we were over-enthusiastic about talking in more detail about the welding of the solid, we were told we had got too much information, as they did not want it to that detail (but i guess it is better to know than not)

I cannot say thank you enough

Suraj