6013 root pass on pipe

[bwservices]

Crap rods = price the jobs properly and buy your welders better rods
Crap gaps = train your fitters to do a better job
Crap access = engineer your runs so the access isn't crap

crap rods = doesn't mean cheap rods.good rods but not as easy to use as others for a root.
crap gaps = a good gap for a fitter is not the same as a good gap for a welder.welders are known as b!tchers,mainly because the setup is never perfect. how many times do you think it would take to cut, bevel and hoist a 6m sched160 pipe into place to get a perfect gap both sides? how efficient would that be? do you scrap the first pipe cost it was 1.5mm too short? you get it 'close enough' and leave the welder moan while he welds it.he'll still get it done in the same time because he is good,and because he can use all rods in all situations. not throw his toys out the pram because the gap was 1mm too tight on top and anyway he only practiced on 6013s with slightly more cellulose in them.
crap access = I shouldn't even have to explain this?have you ever seen a pipe rack?or a set of boiler tubes?or heard of someone setting up a mirror to weld the far side of a pipe because it cannot be accessed/seen without it?how the welder gets in to weld the joint is not usually very high up on the engineers list of priorities

 

[Liquid Metal]

Jabberwocky rods = doesn't mean cheap rods.good rods but not as easy to use as others for a root.
Jabberwocky gaps = a good gap for a fitter is not the same as a good gap for a welder.welders are known as b!tchers,mainly because the setup is never perfect. how many times do you think it would take to cut, bevel and hoist a 6m sched160 pipe into place to get a perfect gap both sides? how efficient would that be? do you scrap the first pipe cost it was 1.5mm too short? you get it 'close enough' and leave the welder moan while he welds it.he'll still get it done in the same time because he is good,and because he can use all rods in all situations. not throw his toys out the pram because the gap was 1mm too tight on top and anyway he only practiced on 6013s with slightly more cellulose in them.
Jabberwocky access = I shouldn't even have to explain this?have you ever seen a pipe rack?or a set of boiler tubes?or heard of someone setting up a mirror to weld the far side of a pipe because it cannot be accessed/seen without it?how the welder gets in to weld the joint is not usually very high up on the engineers list of priorities

Agree 100% with this
Cant walk into a job after testing out, and tell the foreman or bosses.... "im the mutts nuts of a welder, providing that...... the bottom side of the butt is 40 inches off of the floor, nothing within 3ft of it from side to side... as long as your welders are lincoln 405s with remote, only have fleets fresh from the tin, and MUST be vodex that have been left out on the back of a bench, open for minimum of 48hrs. Then, youll get xray standard work 99.99% of the time with the odd repair every now and then when the fitter cocks up and gives me an uneven prep or tight gap".
Youd get laughed back out of the gate.

 

[oilcooled :)]

I'm personally of the opinion that this is a load of tosh.... Get the right rod for the job at hand. Open root stick in the UK/Europe - that'll be filarc 56...

No it’s not if your on a real job some day you weld in accordance to the welding procedure, on the other hand if it’s just a bit of hvac you can weld it with a hammer if your able, but there’s about 20 different times of rod been used in Europe to root pipe not just 56s,

6010 7010 8010
6011 spring to mind

 

[Tigman]

Iv e welded with a mirror a few times ,only way to get to see the joint , cant get your head between the wall and the pipe !

 

[Liquid Metal]

Iv e welded with a mirror a few times ,only way to get to see the joint , cant get your head between the wall and the pipe !

Hand one the other day, a short (1.2m long) spool 12" pipe with an elbow and slip-on one end and just a slip-on the other.
Around 250 back from the end with just the flange, there was a branch going in. This branch was 1.5" with an elbow on the end (inside) pointing along the axis line of the pipe to act as a steam injector.
Due to the product going through it being corrosive the cut through also had to be welded outside and inside so as to not leave anywhere for anything to sit and gather.

Inspection mirror taped to the inside of the pipe, another taped on the torch head, little 6 inch long bits of filler, and LOADS of swearing went on that morning lol.

 

[Liquid Metal]

Not talking about welding circular section steels as part of generalised fab work, but coded pressure rated pipework for petrochemical, offshore, nuclear etc....
A lot of it nowadays, on site or not, is bit by bit steering further and further away from stick roots anyway from what ive noticed and been told by a lot of the older guys i work with. Take petrochemical work, a huge amount of which was fleet root and lowhy or vodex fill and cap.
After advancements in Tig welding, the norm went over to Tig roots, being sold to companies and clients with the plusses of; cleanliness from a quality side, less spatter (dropping risks associated with that) nothing left inside pipe to damage pumps filters valves etc etc over time, less chances of repairs and costly reworks.
After a while became more widespread seeing fleet roots used less, due to clients thinking that it was a huge advancement.

In yards and workshops, a lot is Tig root, wether full tig or vodex/lowhy fill and cap, and GS fluxcore fill for bigger diameter stuff (12" plus).
Quite a few are now moving to Mig roots using Miller RMD, Lincoln STT, Fronius CMT etc followed up with pulsed solidwire/fluxcore/metalcore fill and cap for the speed and productivity factor especially with bigger bore pipe 10" and up, also there is the factor that due to being semi automatic, it takes less time to get somebody up to the standard that they can knock out weld after weld with a modified mig process and pass testing than it will do to get them up to the same standard using stick or tig.