Arc Welders - Cheap vs Expensive

[mishka]

It does look like most transformer types are around 50v

Or look at the older oil-cooled Oxfords, BOCs, etc, and you'll find 50V, 80V and 100V OCV.

Of course, nowadays anything greater than 50V AC (or 120V DC) is considered low voltage (below that is extra low voltage), with corresponding increase in safety requirements

 

[irondarren]

I have just email Malcolm a short video, of a 3.2mm 6013 welding rod, with the power set at 20amps, and the fact that my inverter fusion unit can maintain an arc at 20 amps even though 20 amps isnt really enough power to melt a 3.2mm rod. I am hoping malcolm might be able to hide it somewhere on the site, for all to see, but in the meanwhile if you pm me ill send it to you via email

 

[irondarren]

Just to add this pic done with very damp esab rods (so damp i got an electric shock loading it into the holder. ouch.

4mm rod at 160 amps on the inverter fusion on 8mm thick bar, slag fell off easy, actually more like throw its self off the weld without help. not the best of welds but ill blame it on a damp rod (bad workman always blames his tools ). i might dry them out a try another go

 

[Muggins the Mug]

To my untrained eye it looks like a bloody good weld, damp rod or not...

 

[irondarren]

probaly not that brilliant fusion around the edges, bottom edge doesnt look that clever

 

[Muggins the Mug]

If I could do ones as quarter as good as that, I'd be well chuffed!

 

[bawjaws]

if you call that a bad weld id love to see your good one

 

[irondarren]

20 amp welding video
As i a previous post i said i had emailed malcolm a video holding an arc at 20amps, unforutnatly couldnt get it into a suitable format so it could be hosted on the forum but i have got it upload to you-tube

 

[bawjaws]

nice one, just shows how good the machine is eh

 

[Muggins the Mug]

So far as I have been led to believe (and I'm yet to actually try arc welding) the tendency for rods to stick can be reduced either with a higher voltage or by clever inverter electrickery. Or it can be overcome with practice and a good choice of rods. I suspect the low OCV (open circuit voltage) is a design feature of cheaper AC transformer based welders as even those in the £150 range seem to have 50V OCV.

Though I picked up some suggestion that you weren't best pleased by the quality of the welder you tried, and you might prefer a better quality buzzbox.

Anyone know if the slightly pricier buzzboxes offer a difference in welding experience, or is it just a case of quality, reliability, and a more usable duty cycle?

Hi malcolm,

Just out of interest, I measured the OCV of my Powercraft today and found the following results...

40 Amps = 45V
160 Amps = 53V

The published OCV stated on the box is 48V.

These measurements were taking using an old and cheap digital multimeter using the highest AC range (750V), the lower range setting gave me a difference set of readings. Bloody cheap meters.

Regards,

Ian.

 

[irondarren]

if thats right then 45v on a 40amp rod is low, 53v is obviously better. If your having starting trouble this could explain it

 

[Muggins the Mug]

if thats right then 45v on a 40amp rod is low, 53v is obviously better. If your having starting trouble this could explain it

Hi darren,

The meter I was using was a cheapy one and to be honest the voltage variation is to be expected on a cheapy arc welder. The arc welder welds the same as the previous Powercraft ones did, so it must be the "norm" for them.

Regards,

Ian.

 

[NeilH]

muggines, save me from reading 18 pages to find your posts, what problems are you having?

ive got the powerweld one and im getting on with it fairly ok. it hasnt seen much action since i fixed my mig, but i have a go now and again.

 

[Muggins the Mug]

muggines, save me from reading 18 pages to find your posts, what problems are you having?

ive got the powerweld one and im getting on with it fairly ok. it hasnt seen much action since i fixed my mig, but i have a go now and again.

Hi Neil,

It's not a problem, just an observation. Some posters were referring to the OCV of various machines earlier and I thought it would be interesting to measure my welders and post the results here.

Regards,

Ian.

 

[NeilH]

are you running yours off a house plug

p.s. happy hogmonay

 

[Muggins the Mug]

are you running yours off a house plug

p.s. happy hogmonay

Hi Neil,

Happy Hogmonay too! In answer to your question, I'm running it off of a dedicate 32 Amp supply right below my consumer unit (6mm²x1.5 metres T&E, 32 Amp type B MCB, blue industrial plug, socket and isolator switch).

As long as the welder keeps welding, I'm not too fussed about the OCV - it was only £40 after all. You get what you pay for.

Regards,

Ian.

 

[irondarren]

In all honesty mug, with 6013 weld rods (the normal ones), i really dont see it being much of a problem, yep it will be slightly hard to get an arc than a good inverter. Practice normally takes care of that anyway (inverters make you lazy).
The only real problem i can see is when using 7018's and 7024's they normally like a higher OCV and dont usually like AC. But then again i can see you getting a phone call say can you repair a bridge. Not sure about NiFe (cast iron rods) as to ocv requirements or the liking or disliking of AC. For general repairs and fabrication to mild steel with plain ordinary rods it will be fine

 

[Muggins the Mug]

Hi darren,

Those Phoenix 6013's that Chris gave me recently have worked a treat and running practice beads is no longer a bind (bad pun), but a pleasure. I still get the odd sticking rod, but that's down to me.

Regards,

Ian.

 

[madkayaker]

Hello and welcome. Might be worth posting that in a new post so that it gets seen. A few have been avoiding this post!

 

[madkayaker]

bugger it moved