Merc C250 TD Blowover with non iso 2k nisocoat

[owas]

Some proper vehicles there. I would like to get a W124 or a 190 one day... fit a mild turbo setup to it so it atleast matches the stock OM605/606 turbo. Apparently the NA engines can handle a mild turbo install. Back when I bought my first C 250 TD over 10 yrs ago I wasn't anywhere near as competent at doing stuff like retrofitting turbos, bodywork etc than I am now so I went with the W202 with it being the first turbodiesel merc passenger car ever offered in the UK. The inline pump with no electronics in the fuel and no needle lift sensor on the injectors was what sold me- decent performance and will run WVO really well. I worry that the electronics on the W202 won't age well but so far so good at 25+ years old. I think those 90s cars had high quality digital electronics which are fixable and very long lasting unlike todays stuff. Also people have worked out how to de-immobilise the ECUs and map out stuff like the immo shut off valve, making it easier and cheap to fix ignition and immo issues.
The only comparison I can make to 90s cars and modern cars electronics wise is music making gear,.... Think early 90s Akai sampler (like S950) verus a PC running a soft sampler- the akai can/ will run forever and never crash, the PC may crash frequently and may well die irreparably within 10-15 yrs.
Random comparison lol.

Love the beemer too. I researched getting one instead of a W202 but was put off by all the oil filled suspension bushes and the rotary injector pump with electronics running in the fuel. I think they are aging better than the W202 tho body wise!

My 190 will be getting the m111 from the slk, similar weights so should be ok with just a pulley upgrade,it's only a 1.8 currently.

W124 is def a project, was only £800, which for a diesel 124 i thought was a bargain,solid body wise but it's had a questionable paint job,I'm hoping I can save it though with a cut and polish, or as the Mrs says its 'punk rock'
The engine doesn't want to stop on the key though so I need to get the vacuum gauge out ..hoping to make a start on it this weekend.
Mild turbo set up sounds like a good idea for it.

 

[charlysays]

My 190 will be getting the m111 from the slk, similar weights so should be ok with just a pulley upgrade,it's only a 1.8 currently.

W124 is def a project, was only £800, which for a diesel 124 i thought was a bargain,solid body wise but it's had a questionable paint job,I'm hoping I can save it though with a cut and polish, or as the Mrs says its 'punk rock'
The engine doesn't want to stop on the key though so I need to get the vacuum gauge out ..hoping to make a start on it this weekend.
Mild turbo set up sounds like a good idea for it.

Nice
Is the W124 OM606 or the older single cam engine?

 

[charlysays]

Passed its MOT with no advisories a couple weeks back. Not bad for a 25 yr old bus!
Here it is collecting 250ltrs of free , nice and clean rapeseed waste chip fat... Doing what it does best .
It is a bit of a head turner now. Lots of looks. Reactions from other drivers have changed too which is funny. Despite my driving being more careful it attracts more agro lol, "jerk in a merc" assumptions (possibly accurate some might say).

 

[galooph]

That looks *much* tidier than my 25 year old Surf

 

[charlysays]

Fantastic post.
I'm interested in using this paint and wondered how well the paint is fairing a year on?
Any problems? How scratch/cleaning resistant is it? What about fading etc??
Any info would be appreciated
Matt

Thought I'd give you an update. I'm in touch with a lad on facebook who's also been using nisocoat 2. He has tried the direct gloss and also the clear coat.
He says the clearcoat is more forgiving, will go wet on wet over solvent basecoat as sold by Jawel paints etc or your local auto paint supplier, will go on like glass but has a slight yellowy tinge to it. So that could be a better option for you if you want to reduce the risk of orange peel. The yellow tinge probably won't matter if you're painting the whole car and don't lay it on too thick.
Worth noting that some of the direct gloss colours have leaded pigments in them too which I was unaware of tbh, but regardless , HMG label the tin as containing lead if the colour you order has lead in it. Jet Black was lead free but red and yellow shades may well have leaded pigments in them.

 

[Ianb]

Passed its MOT with no advisories a couple weeks back. Not bad for a 25 yr old bus!
Here it is collecting 250ltrs of free , nice and clean rapeseed waste chip fat... Doing what it does best .
It is a bit of a head turner now. Lots of looks. Reactions from other drivers have changed too which is funny. Despite my driving being more careful it attracts more agro lol, "jerk in a merc" assumptions (possibly accurate some might say).

View attachment 343798

What a lovely car and you have done a superb job, looks good as new.

 

[charlysays]

Not got any pics to upload but the 1 year/ 10k miles update is that it's holding up really well. When I wash it, it looks as good as the day(s) I painted it. It's sat outside in all weathers including the blistering heat we had, some days I measured panel temps in excess of 70 Celsius. Absolutely no fading or other signs of weathering, chalking, no reactions or micro blistering.

Had a handful of stone chips on the front bumper, turns out holts gloss black touch up pen which I'd bought for my bicycle matches the RAL jet black perfectly. Also had two small rust blisters appear which must have been ones I'd missed (I had to deal with literally hundreds of rust spots all the way from the size of a pin head to 2" round so missing a few was inevitable without bare metalling the car).

I learned how to socket/ chip and de-immo the ECU in the last few weeks so have fitted a stage 1 remap at present but have stage 1.5 and stage 2 maps too. Stage 1.5 kinda takes the stock hardware to the limit and will make around 190-200hp, stage 2 around 230hp but struggling to find somewhere which can machine out the stock turbos turbine housing for a bigger turbine wheel (already upsized the comp wheel a fair bit).

Definitely got some more work to do on the body this winter though- replace front suspension and jotamastic the front spring perches and inner wings. Needs some work behind the rear bumper too.

 

[Japtastic]

Thanks for sharing all this info. Really helpful. I'm just about to order some Nisocoat to respray a Vespa. Not sure if I missed it but what grit did you end up on primer before shooting the Nisocoat? Looked for the info in the TDS but just says, refer to the knowledge base.

 

[ajlelectronics]

Thanks for sharing all this info. Really helpful. I'm just about to order some Nisocoat to respray a Vespa. Not sure if I missed it but what grit did you end up on primer before shooting the Nisocoat? Looked for the info in the TDS but just says, refer to the knowledge base.

You may get away with 500 dry, but 800 dry would be perfect.

 

[charlysays]

You may get away with 500 dry, but 800 dry would be perfect.

I'd agree. I used 600 dry and some marks showed up in the gloss after a few weeks. Nothing a flat and polish wouldn't take out but I'm too lazy for that lol.

 

[charlysays]

Thanks for sharing all this info. Really helpful. I'm just about to order some Nisocoat to respray a Vespa. Not sure if I missed it but what grit did you end up on primer before shooting the Nisocoat? Looked for the info in the TDS but just says, refer to the knowledge base.

It should be great for spraying a bike especially seeing as it has excellent chemical resistance. Petrol doesn't touch it.

 

[Japtastic]

Excellent, thanks. Yeah, 2 stroke tends to be messy and fly about everywhere on the old bikes so should be ideal!

 

[Siddus74]

Painted the shell shuts and rear quarters. This has taken a while to happen because of all the rust I found. Both rear arches needed some reconstruction.
Bought myself a couple of 1000w infrared heat lamps and they are pretty decent for a tenner each. They'll get that black paint up to 50c pretty fast from a metre away.
I'm gonna relax a bit now as all the big bits are done. With the heat lamps I can paint stuff like doors etc in poor weather but I still aim to get it all finished in October.

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OMG for a non iso top coat that looks ace! Very tempted to do my project in this now.

Im in a single garage with a 90ltr 14cfm comp LVLP gun.

Looking and reading your other posts you used a 1.3 at 30psi HVLP - how do you think my set up will work in comparison?

Also you reduced to 40percent .. is that 40percent on the total volume or as an percentage of the other elements?

 

[charlysays]

OMG for a non iso top coat that looks ace! Very tempted to do my project in this now.

Im in a single garage with a 90ltr 14cfm comp LVLP gun.

Looking and reading your other posts you used a 1.3 at 30psi HVLP - how do you think my set up will work in comparison?

Also you reduced to 40percent .. is that 40percent on the total volume or as an percentage of the other elements?

Thanks, I was pleased how it turned out. don't get me wrong it's far from perfect but it still looks good gun finish and could be better still with a flat and polish.
14cfm is what I used too but I had 350l storage, it'll be fine as the paint properties kinda precludes painting huge areas in one go.
I actually ended up using 40psi at the gun in the end as at 30psi I had to hose it on so thick to avoid peel. Just trying to reduce orange peel as much as possible.
As you can see though the peel was never bad enough to cause a gloss issue.
The 40% is a good question. I used mixing cups and just guestimated where the 40% line would be above the 30% line as none of my mixing cups go up to 40%. It's all a bit of a mystery to me but I can assure you that it wasn't a percentage of total volume.

 

[600rob]

This is a fantastic thread. I've been doing all the research to go and get set up to paint full 2k paint until I came across this info.

Means I can hopefully get a decent enough look using my nisocoat clear over 1k vehicle colour for the items I occasionally paint.

I had a couple of questions hopefully someone can answer.

1. Does anyone know the difference between nisocoat and nisocoat 2?

Can't really see much on the sites that sell it telling me the differences

2. Cleaning up, are standard gunwash thinners ok for cleaning up the gun after spraying?

 

[charlysays]

This is a fantastic thread. I've been doing all the research to go and get set up to paint full 2k paint until I came across this info.

Means I can hopefully get a decent enough look using my nisocoat clear over 1k vehicle colour for the items I occasionally paint.

I had a couple of questions hopefully someone can answer.

1. Does anyone know the difference between nisocoat and nisocoat 2?

Can't really see much on the sites that sell it telling me the differences

2. Cleaning up, are standard gunwash thinners ok for cleaning up the gun after spraying?

glad it's been helpful!

I don't know the difference between nisocoat hs and nisocoat 2. Maybe nisocoat 1 is discontinued.
Nisocoat 2 is what I used on my car.
The sites are vague for sure.

Standard gunwash is good, as is normal 2k thinner for thinning the paint. Use slow thinner.

 

[600rob]

Just re-read through this again in prep to respray a front and rear bumper that's suffering from lacquer peel peel and faded paint

I might have missed it somewhere in the thread but did you prime your bumpers with?

@charlysays

 

[charlysays]

Just re-read through this again in prep to respray a front and rear bumper that's suffering from lacquer peel peel and faded paint

I might have missed it somewhere in the thread but did you prime your bumpers with?

@charlysays

Rear one I just spot primed where needed (filler repairs) , front one I used lechler 29107. Better finish with the lecher, once cured it won't let the top coat sink into any repairs or bits where you've rubbed through a layer.

 

[SJones]

This post is really helpful and read it several times as I start to get everything I need ready! I do have some questions though
My plan is to do a normal paint job and then use nisocoat 2 as a clear, it was mentioned that there was someone on Facebook that did this process, do you know if they used the same amount of thinner when they used the clear?
Also you mentioned that you used slow thinner, do you remember what temperature you was painting at at the time? And again, you mentioned 40% thinner, was this 40% of the overall mixture(2:1:2?) this seems a fair bit higher than the tech sheet says, I'm assuming you had done tests before hand? How did they turn out at the stated rate?

 

[charlysays]

This post is really helpful and read it several times as I start to get everything I need ready! I do have some questions though
My plan is to do a normal paint job and then use nisocoat 2 as a clear, it was mentioned that there was someone on Facebook that did this process, do you know if they used the same amount of thinner when they used the clear?
Also you mentioned that you used slow thinner, do you remember what temperature you was painting at at the time? And again, you mentioned 40% thinner, was this 40% of the overall mixture(2:1:2?) this seems a fair bit higher than the tech sheet says, I'm assuming you had done tests before hand? How did they turn out at the stated rate?

Yeah I know a guy who used nisocoat 2 clear over a solvent basecoat. He said it worked fine and was easier to spray than the direct gloss.
Both me and him noticed that to get a good gloss fun finish you have to use a slow speed of travel with the gun compared to automotive 2k paint.
He just experimented with thinner like I did. I used calibrated paint mixing pots for all the ratio measurement.
These mark out your initial ratio (2:1) but then for some reason use a percentage for the thinner. No idea how this tallies with the 3 part ratio quoted for nisocoat (2:1: less than 0.75)
Most cups only go up to 30% thinner. It's definitely not 30% of the total volume. I found 30% not enough with my setup so I guessed where the 40% line would be and put a line of masking tape on the cup and filled to there and ended up using 40psi pressure with the trigger pulled.
Temperature varied from around 12 degrees to 25 degrees during painting over a few months) I just adjusted my application technique to suit.
I used a cordless inspection lamp in my spare hand while spraying to check how wet the paint was going on and just hosed it on til it looked good.
The slow thinner was to help reduce the classic nisocoat issue of it flashing off way too quick and I'd advise using slow thinner for all but very small parts.