Puddle pump. Help!

[Screwdriver]

I need to drain a basement with only 2 inches of water but spread over a huge area. A submersible pump wont get down to the last few mm (it wont even start to pump at 2 inches) so I am planning to use a small pump to fill a bucket and run a head pump from the bucket to lift it the 5 metres or so to the surface.

I have a solution for keeping both pumps primed and happy.

Don't want to use a drill powered pump, I need a decent suction pump (diaphragm?) and it needs to be fairly chunky and able to run for a day or two. I'll work out the total when I get back to the desktop.

Happy to look at basically anything that might work and also happy to make up whatever may be needed as a little construction project. I do need something in a hurry though so your input will be greatly appreciated.

S.

 

[ukracer]

I need to drain a basement with only 2 inches of water but spread over a huge area. A submersible pump wont get down to the last few mm (it wont even start to pump at 2 inches) so I am planning to use a small pump to fill a bucket and run a head pump from the bucket to lift it the 5 metres or so to the surface.

I have a solution for keeping both pumps primed and happy.

Don't want to use a drill powered pump, I need a decent suction pump (diaphragm?) and it needs to be fairly chunky and able to run for a day or two. I'll work out the total when I get back to the desktop.

Happy to look at basically anything that might work and also happy to make up whatever may be needed as a little construction project. I do need something in a hurry though so your input will be greatly appreciated.

S.

Cant you create a sump?

 

[Screwdriver]

Ok so I reckon there's about 5 cubic metres or 5000 litres to shift. Incidentally, this is the same volume of water from "help I need a surveyor" and the same problem where I don't want to just dump it into the foundations.

 

[Screwdriver]

Cant you create a sump?

No and the floor is spectacularly level. According to my precision wellies, less than 1/4 inch difference from the shallowest point to the deepest at dead centre.

 

[penfold]

Anything other than a wet vac will not work and will drive you bananas with lost prime; put a sump pump in a bin and empty the wet vac into the bin to speed things up. A speedier and more expensive solution would be to hire a company with a vacuum wagon to empty it; people who deal with septic tanks etc will have what's needed. Not having a sump in the floor is the killer for conventional pump solutions.

 

[Screwdriver]

Hmm. I think someone is selling one right now....

Incidentally, it's not a floor yet. It's the base of the concrete form, plenty more floor to go on top of it yet and they'll be putting in a pump system though, now you mention it, you would have thought there should be a pre cast sump. Maybe one of the many drainage pipes which are installed but have been left tall form part of a sump system

I can't or daren't start playing with any of that though I have now met the builder who is sending someone over to shore up and backfill that dodgy clay wall. I should update the other thread I guess.

 

[carbon]

Do you have a decent pressure washer as mud suckers can work quite well but would still leave some water behind. The higher the output from the pressure washer the higher volume of dirty water the mud sucker can extract

 

[Screwdriver]

Oh. Err, hang on. If I use a Henry Hoover or some other wet vac, how do I get the water to fill a bucket continually? Surely if I make a hole in it, it will lose suction?

 

[penfold]

If you really want something to tinker with you could try to knock up an eductor to run off a compressor; PVC pipe is easy to bodge something together with.

Oh. Err, hang on. If I use a Henry Hoover or some other wet vac, how do I get the water to fill a bucket continually? Surely if I make a hole in it, it will lose suction?

You have to empty it manually, which is bore but you can shift a lot of water quite quickly like this.

 

[Screwdriver]

Do you have a decent pressure washer as mud suckers can work quite well but would still leave some water behind. The higher the output from the pressure washer the higher volume of dirty water the mud sucker can extract

Yes, I actually tried that out already with my old power washer. It does draw water from a short hose and it even shifts it up and out of the basement but the flow rate is horrible and I would need a comprehensive filter arrangement. I may revisit that idea but my old converted Wickes unit is on its last legs and noisy as hell!

Good call though. Thanks.

 

[Screwdriver]

If you really want something to tinker with you could try to knock up an eductor to run off a compressor; PVC pipe is easy to bodge something together with.


You have to empty it manually, which is bore but you can shift a lot of water quite quickly like this.

Plenty of pipe work to play with and it sounds fun but my compressor is concreted into a bunker two doors away and I piled a ton of reclaimed bricks in front of it just to make sure.

 

[daleyd]

If you really want something to tinker with you could try to knock up an eductor to run off a compressor; PVC pipe is easy to bodge something together with.

We used to have fixed eductors in the large machinery spaces on board run from the fire main - they shifted more water than pretty much any of the electric or diesel powered pumps we had on board.

 

[DaveB]

I've used a clarke puddle pump at work and found it very effective, but you'd still need to get on to the slab with a broom to push the last of the water towards the pump.

 

[rtbcomp]

Oh. Err, hang on. If I use a Henry Hoover or some other wet vac, how do I get the water to fill a bucket continually? Surely if I make a hole in it, it will lose suction?

Can't you fit the vacuum cleaner mechanism to a dustbin instead of the lid so it fills the dustbin directly and the sump pump (inside the dustbin) kicks in at the appropriate level?

 

[addjunkie]

We used to have fixed eductors in the large machinery spaces on board run from the fire main - they shifted more water than pretty much any of the electric or diesel powered pumps we had on board.

Dont hurt when run dry either....only issue, grossly inefficient, as you need a big pump to drive the main water flow.

Works with air too if you get your sums right and have the right size orifice in the venturi.

 

[carbon]

Mud suckers are an attachment to fit on the output from the washer and can handle dirty water with ease. The pressure washer would need to be run from a clean supply.

 

[penfold]

The Sunday name for that is an eductor, a fancypants name for a device that uses a high pressure supply of fluid to create a pressure differential. The fluid can be anything but is most commonly air or water.

 

[carbon]

Ok thanks

 

[Screwdriver]

Can't you fit the vacuum cleaner mechanism to a dustbin instead of the lid so it fills the dustbin directly and the sump pump (inside the dustbin) kicks in at the appropriate level?

Interesting conundrum though, running a water pump inside a low pressure environment. Would need a non collapsing hose run through the body. I guess you could fit a submersible pump inside a big enough wet vac but the different flow rate would also cause issues. The sub pump would be shifting a lot more water than the wet vac.

 

[brightspark]

The Sunday name for that is an eductor.

what's it called on a Saturday