Renault Kangoo - help with engine problems

[roofman]

they are also very handy for changing valve stem seals or broken valve springs without removing head.

yes very correctamundo

 

[puffernutter]

I like that - a quick blow job

 

[roofman]

I like that - a quick blow job

take the oil filler top off and the dip stick out or you run the risk of blowing the front and rear main crank seals

 

[normspanners]

The crankcase breather should take care of the flow but they can get a little restricted on old cruddy engines

but if you take the oil filler cap off then listen to how much is passing the rings compare with the good ones

 

[puffernutter]

Right, another interesting evening! As suggested I dismantled my compression tester to create an easy method of putting pressure in the cylinder and I wound the pressure down to about 50psi. I started with #2 as that had the lowest compression. On TDC (compression), exhaust valve clearance was 0.3mm and when applying pressure there was a leak through the exhaust port (I've taken the exhaust manifold off). #1 was 0.45 and on applying pressure it moved the piston down, #4 was 0.2 (but no leakage and #3 was 0.5 and no leakage.

My regular engine re-conditioner in Westbury appears to have gone off line (telephone gives unobtainable), however a place in Bath with cut the seat, grind the valve and skim the head for £56. So I think That's the next step.

I'll let you know what happens next!

Cheers

Peter

 

[roofman]

Right, another interesting evening! As suggested I dismantled my compression tester to create an easy method of putting pressure in the cylinder and I wound the pressure down to about 50psi. I started with #2 as that had the lowest compression. On TDC (compression), exhaust valve clearance was 0.3mm and when applying pressure there was a leak through the exhaust port (I've taken the exhaust manifold off). #1 was 0.45 and on applying pressure it moved the piston down, #4 was 0.2 (but no leakage and #3 was 0.5 and no leakage.

My regular engine re-conditioner in Westbury appears to have gone off line (telephone gives unobtainable), however a place in Bath with cut the seat, grind the valve and skim the head for £56. So I think That's the next step.

I'll let you know what happens next!

Cheers

Peter

looks like your making progress in finding the running problem

 

[premmington]

Right, another interesting evening! As suggested I dismantled my compression tester to create an easy method of putting pressure in the cylinder and I wound the pressure down to about 50psi. I started with #2 as that had the lowest compression. On TDC (compression), exhaust valve clearance was 0.3mm and when applying pressure there was a leak through the exhaust port (I've taken the exhaust manifold off). #1 was 0.45 and on applying pressure it moved the piston down, #4 was 0.2 (but no leakage and #3 was 0.5 and no leakage.

My regular engine re-conditioner in Westbury appears to have gone off line (telephone gives unobtainable), however a place in Bath with cut the seat, grind the valve and skim the head for £56. So I think That's the next step.

I'll let you know what happens next!

Cheers

Peter

Leak down testing with the valves "on rock" shows up more than compression testing for sure.

I drilled a glowplug today to get some air pressure into a diesel engine to find a leaky intake valve.

 

[normspanners]

It was at a specialists for the last few days and they even had an external specialist look at it!

specialists my a**e--------- VERY special IMO.

hose in the number2 then blow regulated air pressure in and see where the air is coming out my guess is the exhaust valves

That was a good guess and that was 'listening' over the internet, but you did try to fool us in the beginning HA

Compression test shows all cylinders are OK.

Before you take the head off open that valve by putting it on full lift if you have removed the ex manifold borrow a bore scope ( endoscope) and have a look it might be something stuck to the valve seat it could be small lump of carbon etc.
Which is unlikely but possible because you did say it would run ok now and again which is indicative of tight followers.
If they where tight then a piece of carbon stuck in the seat, would give you false clearance

 

[normspanners]

I have ground a valve clean with stuck carbon etc without taking the head off once when in an emergency saved head gasket /skim / time etc etc.

 

[AndyStobbs]

You will get some passage, but shouldn't get lots. I spray some wd40 behind the valve head which bubbles as the air comes up. Even a freshly ground seat and new valve, lapped together will pass a little.

 

[puffernutter]

All, yet again thanks for the advice and suggestions. I have a USB boroscope, but as I think there is an issue there, I'm just a hobby mechanic and the engine is not in the first flush of youth, for the sake of £56 (and the hassle of taking it off!) the engine reconditioner will put it on his test rig and I'll get a view on if it's just that one valve; or get more done if needed. At least I'll know then that the head isn't the problem. Of course this is still a punt, but none of the diagnostics have shown any error codes on the sensors.

 

[normspanners]

OK your choice but you can remove and replace the valve spring using your compression tester adapter by putting engine on tdc on compression stroke ( thanks snooper ) and fill with full compressor pressure which holds the valves closed allowing you to remove the collets if that doent work I have used gear oil in there. Then disconnect the compressor and your valve is free to rotate
then get some fuel pipe that is a tight fit on the valve stem and re grind it with minimum of paste on the valve seat by pulling up on the pipe between your palms use some paraffin down the plug hole followed by an air blower to wash out cyl


Rover t series where a pain they used to carbon the valve stems up and would start to miss when hot caused by the stems getting tight in the guides because of the carbon deposits but I developed this way of cleaning the stems without the cost of the head being removed.I used a cordless drill on the end of the pipe to spin the valves whilst holding fine emery on valve stem.
it took a little while to do the eight but it saved a load of work / expense.

 

[puffernutter]

If it were a "known" engine, I may be tempted, the trouble is that this is a total unknown and whilst it's more expensive than doing it myself (especially when you consider the cost of the head gasket set, head bolts etc., I reckon it's a price worth paying to "baseline" the head. Let's jut hope this is the problem and I've nt just thrown another £160 away! (It's nickname is the BBC - That Bl@@dy Blue Car"!)

 

[roofman]

Another fix for holding the valve into its seat is to get a long balloon,the type that you stick between your legs when blown up and bragg to the missus ...Anyway put it into the bore on TDC and blow it up and tie a knot in the end..the inflated balloon then keeps the valve closed

 

[normspanners]

stick between your legs when blown up and bragg to the missus .

Funny that i've never needed to do that good idea though .

 

[AndyStobbs]

I've never done this trick of pumping up a cylinder to save the valves dropping in, and can't figure out how one would compress the valve spring enough to get the the collets free of the top hat? I can see the valve staying up once its all removed, but valve springs can be right tough even with the head on the bench.

 

[roofman]

I've never done this trick of pumping up a cylinder to save the valves dropping in, and can't figure out how one would compress the valve spring enough to get the the collets free of the top hat? I can see the valve staying up once its all removed, but valve springs can be right tough even with the head on the bench.

more often than not you need to knock a tool up to fix into a cam cap bolt thread or a rocker and get a fulcrum going to compress the spring...its amazing what you can knock up if its a choice of removing the head or getting around the problem of a lever tool with a camel toe end on it

 

[puffernutter]

Have a look at these.

Cylinder 1 - next to gearbox

Cylinder 2 -

Cylinder 3 -

Cylinder 4 -

I reckon #1 and #4 are fine, #2 is probably causing the problem and #3 is heading the way of #2

The next problem is getting it all back together again......

Cheers

Peter

 

[the snooper]

is it the light or is #1 the only one fully black, I would expect all to be fully black

 

[puffernutter]

Could be the light. #1 & #4 both are "clean" and not seriously pitted.

Cheers

Peter