What certification for plasma cutting?

[Hitch]

Unfortunately its the world we live in. I feel sorry for Pete having to demonstrate his obvious competence. But I guess that’s what the bit of paper proves.

It’s all about money kiddies

Absolutely.

In 23 years in the industry, working on and off site for various big firms, blue chip companies, global companies, etc, I've never been asked for that.



Sorry Pete, going a bit sideways here.

 

[KimB]

What ever happened to assumed general competency for simple tasks related to your industry.

Depending on what it's for, is this to say you can drag a plasma torch along a straight edge, or is this a certificate relating to heat inputs, cutting speeds, HAZ removal prior to welding etc.. ?

I agree with this. Obviously like in my field. Anyone with a class 1 hgv licence can legally do my job but would they have the competency and is there any test or something you can do so on paper you’d have something to show competency. The answers no to the both of them. Maybe as Parm says, manufacturers training but for what I’ve said there’s nothing available that I know of for the user.

 

[Parm]

In 23 years in the industry, working on site for various big firms, blue chip companies, global companies, etc, I've never been asked for that.[/QUOTE]


Only required on construction and demolition sites

 

[Hitch]

In 23 years in the industry, working on site for various big firms, blue chip companies, global companies, etc, I've never been asked for that.

Only required on construction and demolition sites[/QUOTE]

Yeah... I was thinking back a couple of years ago to my more construction based days. Never got asked for one by Balfour Beatty on a £550mil site.

 

[Parm]

Only required on construction and demolition sites

Yeah... I was thinking back a couple of years ago to my more construction based days. Never got asked for one by Balfour Beatty on a £550mil site.[/QUOTE]

in the last few years it’s become quite big. Clever marketing

 

[addjunkie]

Yep that too. It’s only when you go to a top tier COMHA site that you understand what a proper site induction is

Some are better than others I can assure you! When I returned to the North Sea, I couldnt believe just how bad and out of date their induction was. Wish Id kept my mouth shut. Got the job of fixing it.

I agree with this. Obviously like in my field. Anyone with a class 1 hgv licence can legally do my job but would they have the competency and is there any test or something you can do so on paper you’d have something to show competency. The answers no to the both of them. Maybe as Parm says, manufacturers training but for what I’ve said there’s nothing available that I know of for the user.

If there is no specific ticket/card, your employers could develop and train assessors verifiers for their own competency process. This would then be used to demonstrate to prospective customers how your organisation trains/develops people and maintain their on going competency
Quite common in large organisations often used to pacify Mr Parm and his mates. Is it really any good, well like many of these schemes all depends hows its done and by whom.

 

[Pete.]

I'm not a lift installer. I mostly do selective demolition. It means the I rarely have to worry about the quality of the end product because there's never anything left when I'm finished. In this case we have had a steel structures company install some temporary works for us and part of it involved in-filling some service holes originally cut into the webs of the beams. The client wants the holes re-instated so they can put services through them but there's a site-wide prohibition on using a oxy torch against the original structure. so whlst I was fine to cut anything WE installed I have a dozen holes to cut into large beams that I'm prohibited from using oxy-fuel to do.

In most instances I will know what competency I (or someone I'm responsible for) would need but this is a bit of a special case. A plasma cutter is a very unusual piece of equipment to find on site (we bought it about five years ago to cut up a stainless steel concourse canopy), it's more of a production/workshop tool. Nobody knows anything about them so they fall back on the default "I want to see the operator's training cert". In reality a cutting torch is far more hazardous, uses COSHH gases, is a huge firse risk in use (and in storage) but it's commonlace and accepted plus oxy-fuel cutting is easy to get training for.

 

[Parm]

Quite common in large organisations often used to pacify Mr Parm and his mates. Is it really any good, well like many of these schemes all depends hows its done and by whom.

The key is competency. This is a common question I’m required to answer when doing independent expert witness work for the courts.

Competency is a education, training and experience

sadly many folk think sitting a test and getting a card is competency. It’s a function of clever marketing by those that run these schemes.

And yes, what you say about an in-house scheme is often the best. Who better than in house folk to train others about thier risks. No one knows it better than them. I’ve seen some realy very good stuff

 

[Pete.]

TBH the only other timeI've come up against this problem of training is when I hired some walk-behind diesel powered tracked barrows. You can hire them but there is (or was) no specific training. The site however insisted that if someone was going to use powered plant then they must be trained in it's use. I had to write a familiarisation and brief the workers on it based on excerpts from the user manual.

 

[Parm]

I'm not a lift installer. I mostly do selective demolition. It means the I rarely have to worry about the quality of the end product because there's never anything left when I'm finished. In this case we have had a steel structures company install some temporary works for us and part of it involved in-filling some service holes originally cut into the webs of the beams. The client wants the holes re-instated so they can put services through them but there's a site-wide prohibition on using a oxy torch against the original structure. so whlst I was fine to cut anything WE installed I have a dozen holes to cut into large beams that I'm prohibited from using oxy-fuel to do.

In most instances I will know what competency I (or someone I'm responsible for) would need but this is a bit of a special case. A plasma cutter is a very unusual piece of equipment to find on site (we bought it about five years ago to cut up a stainless steel concourse canopy), it's more of a production/workshop tool. Nobody knows anything about them so they fall back on the default "I want to see the operator's training cert". In reality a cutting torch is far more hazardous, uses COSHH gases, is a huge firse risk in use (and in storage) but it's commonlace and accepted plus oxy-fuel cutting is easy to get training for.

haven’t you got any NFDC supervisor or above tickets?

 

[Pete.]

haven’t you got any NFDC supervisor or above tickets?

I have NDFC demolition supervisor, and oxy-fuel cutting.

 

[Parm]

I have NDFC demolition supervisor, and oxy-fuel cutting.

That should cover you for (almost) everything. If I was given that reassurance I wouldn’t be asking any more questions.

have you been dealing with an elf n saaafffeeettyyy person?

 

[Hitch]

Ah, got you confused with someone else.

This is quite interesting. Only ever been involved with small demo jobs ran by ourselves.

I guess the site wide gas torch ban is to stop people just hacking away at whatever they see fit?

A plasma will be as much of a fire risk...
You may eliminate the coshh for the gas, but then you introduce electricity/ electrocution, fuel for generators/compressors.. trailing cables, hoses...

They do realise it will do the same job as a gas torch in most instances right.... ?

 

[Pete.]

That should cover you for (almost) everything. If I was given that reassurance I wouldn’t be asking any more questions.

have you been dealing with an elf n saaafffeeettyyy person?

Just the site team, who in fairness are very reasonable. They are heavily audited though and they are bound by their own strict company policies so I can't blame them. I write most of the RAMs and it usually takes between 2 and 4 submissions to get approval. I think I have more individual RAMS than all of the other contractors combined.

 

[Pete.]

Ah, got you confused with someone else.

This is quite interesting. Only ever been involved with small demo jobs ran by ourselves.

I guess the site wide gas torch ban is to stop people just hacking away at whatever they see fit?

A plasma will be as much of a fire risk...
You may eliminate the coshh for the gas, but then you introduce electricity/ electrocution, fuel for generators/compressors.. trailing cables, hoses...

They do realise it will do the same job as a gas torch in most instances right.... ?

The gas torch ban in only for the original structure that gets retained, it's imposed by the project structural engineer. So if I'm removing a beam I can cut within 300mm of a bit that doesn't come out, then it must be a grinder. Thankfully most are bolted connections.

YOu're right, people can (and have) done a lot of damage with a torch. Like that power station that collapsed a few years ago.

 

[Parm]

Like that power station that collapsed a few years ago.

large sections of that steel structure are at our labs in Buxton. I’ve seen what went wrong and how

 

[Hitch]

I suppose with a big nozzle and an over zealous person on the lever you could blow a 4" overcut quite easily.

 

[Kayos]

CSCS is the most useless “thing” ever

any idiot can pass a multi choice test and get a card

The fact I have a CSCS black card is more than proof of that

 

[The_Yellow_Ardvark]

CSCS is the most useless “thing” ever

any idiot can pass a multi choice test and get a card

@Parm.
Last year when I retook mine. The answers were on the display items in the room.
5 questions.
1 clearly wrong.
2 more were just draft.
1 just reworded the question.

During the one hour preamble the instructor all but gave us the answer.

Even then. 5 out of 20 failed.

 

[eLuSiVeMiTe]

@Parm.
Last year when I retook mine. The answers were on the display items in the room.
5 questions.
1 clearly wrong.
2 more were just draft.
1 just reworded the question.

During the one hour preamble the instructor all but gave us the answer.

Even then. 5 out of 20 failed.

And that's why we have so many rules and regs. Idiots would be weeded out of sites quickly not given a special card to say they know there a b C's and let loose on the site