Log Fires - the future?

[fizzy]

Log burners are great. Especially if you can process bulk logs yourself- a chainsaw, chainsaw chop horse (turns the chainsaw into a chop saw come saw horse) and a log splitter. I have a titan one which does a decent job splitting logs as long as the grain isn't too wild. You can buy or sometimes get the bulk lumber free from tree surgeons. Or if you have some land cultivate your own timber. buying logs in can still be cost effective but much less so. If your house is well insulated a downstairs log burner can heat the whole house and in the warmer parts of the UK, you won't need your central heating at all. Shame that you can't get boiler stoves anymore. New ones aren't made anymore because the boiler cools the firebox too much and causes bad emissions apparently. Not really an issue in a really rural setting but not good in a more built up area.

I never new that - so you can't buy a woodburner to heat a giant heatstore? What about the commercial types?

 

[fizzy]

Do "Y'all" have wood pellets "over there" ?

Yes - many people use them. Not cheap though - getting the moisture out of them can't be good for the environment either.

 

[Burdekin]

There's nothing difficult about mining coal. That's a load of nonsense.

With todays technology and machinery availability, an open cast mine in the right location could run all of the remaining coal plants we have.

I worked in coal mines for a couple of years, mainly underground and they are probably technically the most difficult and unsafest of all. Where you get coal the ground above and below is typically soft so harder to support. One I worked at collapsed at the face as the chocks just sank into the ground as they tried to hold up the roof. Add in methane and coal dust then you can have quite an explosive atmosphere, coal can self combust as well so needs to be constantly monitored and all the machinery needs to be IS. Watering all the roads to keep the dust down and spraying the walls with lime to suffocate any explosions. Worked in bauxite, gold, silver, uranium and coal mines and coal mines are the worst. Horrible places. Granted open cast these days is much more viable and the way to go if shallow enough.

 

[Brad93]

I worked in coal mines for a couple of years, mainly underground and they are probably technically the most difficult and unsafest of all. Where you get coal the ground above and below is typically soft so harder to support. One I worked at collapsed at the face as the chocks just sank into the ground as they tried to hold up the roof. Add in methane and coal dust then you can have quite an explosive atmosphere, coal can self combust as well and all the machinery needs to be IS. Watering all the road to keep the dust down and spraying the walls with lime to suffocate any explosions. H

Hence open cast mining.

 

[brewdexta]

Do "Y'all" have wood pellets "over there" ?

yes, bought a tonne yesterday. Gone up since the Ukraine war as most of the pellets were byproducts of the timber construction industry in Austria etc. But the timber came from Siberia....

Yesterday's tonne was 400 quid, Scottish called Puffin Pellets. I confirmed it was all timber from managed forests, no puffin content

 

[brewdexta]

Yes - many people use them. Not cheap though - getting the moisture out of them can't be good for the environment either.

The Austrian pellets I got before the Ukrainian war was from the offcuts from the timber construction industry. They used some off the offcuts for pellets, and some of the offcuts to fuel the drying process.

 

[Burdekin]

yes, bought a tonne yesterday. Gone up since the Ukraine war as most of the pellets were byproducts of the timber construction industry in Austria etc. But the timber came from Siberia....

Yesterday's tonne was 400 quid, Scottish called Puffin Pellets. I confirmed it was all timber from managed forests, no puffin content

My mate's neighbour's family business.

 

[brewdexta]

My mate's neighbour's family business.

Mates rates?

I used to go through about 10 tonne a year.

I've since turned the stats down and issued blankets so hopefully down to 6 tonne including the workshop.

 

[Rrobson]

There's nothing difficult about mining coal. That's a load of nonsense.

With todays technology and machinery availability, an open cast mine in the right location could run all of the remaining coal plants we have.

Well, there is technically only one and a half coal stations left, so that wouldn’t take much effort and ratcliffe is due to shut next year anyway, so end of next year there will be three units at drax (albeit the same output as the four at ratcliffe).

If the government really wanted to go down the coal fired route, and had a station build with efficiency at heart, a well designed system with lots of heat recovery systems and all the modern turbine designs could easily be at least as efficient as the modern gas stations. Same with central heating systems, heat recovery could easily heat a water tank.
Uk has some of the best coal around… problem with open cast is there isn’t enough real estate in this country to dig a big hole. Germany’s lignite mines are epic. A quick google shows three cover a combined area of nearly 100 square miles. Suppose there’s plenty of space in wales…

 

[fizzy]

Mates rates?

I used to go through about 10 tonne a year.

I've since turned the stats down and issued blankets so hopefully down to 6 tonne including the workshop.

In my old farm house above the tree line in the Brecon Beacons I burned 52 tons of logs in 1 winter
The house I am in now is in a valley - we never see the sun but it is pretty sheltered.
There are 23 radiators here but I hardly ever use the central heating. Oil fired AGA one end - big woodburner the other. A 1 tonne dumpy bag full lasts me about 5 days. Probably about 500kg a time. Good job my wood is free

 

[finyuk2005]

Do "Y'all" have wood pellets "over there?

yeah, my folks have a pretty big pellet boiler 60kw i think,
I just filled the hopper the other day, 80 x 10kg bags of pellets..... i was just wondering how much energy all that plastic bags contained.... how very enviromentally friendly

 

[brewdexta]

In my old farm house above the tree line in the Brecon Beacons I burned 52 tons of logs in 1 winter
The house I am in now is in a valley - we never see the sun but it is pretty sheltered.
There are 23 radiators here but I hardly ever use the central heating. Oil fired AGA one end - big woodburner the other. A 1 tonne dumpy bag full lasts me about 5 days. Probably about 500kg a time. Good job my wood is free

I'm up a big hill too, very exposed, but less of my hobbies

 

[brewdexta]

yeah, my folks have a pretty big pellet boiler 60kw i think,
I just filled the hopper the other day, 80 x 10kg bags of pellets..... i was just wondering how much energy all that plastic bags contained.... how very enviromentally friendly

Getting it pumped in bulk is better, but the cost of the hopper and auger put me off as bags are only marginally dearer.

 

[fizzy]

Well, there is technically only one and a half coal stations left, so that wouldn’t take much effort and ratcliffe is due to shut next year anyway, so end of next year there will be three units at drax (albeit the same output as the four at ratcliffe).

If the government really wanted to go down the coal fired route, and had a station build with efficiency at heart, a well designed system with lots of heat recovery systems and all the modern turbine designs could easily be at least as efficient as the modern gas stations. Same with central heating systems, heat recovery could easily heat a water tank.
Uk has some of the best coal around… problem with open cast is there isn’t enough real estate in this country to dig a big hole. Germany’s lignite mines are epic. A quick google shows three cover a combined area of nearly 100 square miles. Suppose there’s plenty of space in wales…

Epic?
Epic destruction more like.
Since Germany got rid of it's last 3 nuclear power stations their CO2 has gone through the roof. So much for all their renewables.
Germany is now putting out as much as 700gm per kw CO2
France are between 20 and 40gm. The difference is mind blowing and yet France is facing fines for not having enough renewables I thought the goal was to reduce CO2 emissions?

 

[Burdekin]

Mates rates?

I used to go through about 10 tonne a year.

I've since turned the stats down and issued blankets so hopefully down to 6 tonne including the workshop.

They get a good rates but they are quite new in the property and he doesn't seem to like the pellet boiler. Might change in time.

 

[Richiew]

Fizzy sounds back in rude health.

 

[finyuk2005]

Getting it pumped in bulk is better, but the cost of the hopper and auger put me off as bags are only marginally dearer.

yeah, that was the hope, but there isnt enough demand up here for them to come up very often, dad was going to try and get in with a few folk he knows that get much bigger loads than us,
We can store 3t,
I suggested we use a heap of clean, dry IBC's, could head to our friends when they get a big load blown in, with the IBC's on the tractor and trailer

 

[Erie Fred]

yeah, my folks have a pretty big pellet boiler 60kw i think,
I just filled the hopper the other day, 80 x 10kg bags of pellets..... i was just wondering how much energy all that plastic bags contained.... how very enviromentally friendly

Early fall had the local pellet suppliers offering a ton of pallets shrink wrapped on pallets for a discount.

IIRC $230-250

 

[charlysays]

I never new that - so you can't buy a woodburner to heat a giant heatstore? What about the commercial types?

Probably could get some kind of commercial boiler stove, I'm not sure on that. Domestic ones are no more though. Decent used domestic boiler stoves are becoming a bit more valuable now they're not made anymore as there's still a need for them. Either install yourself or get a professional to install off the books if they're willing. Registered stove installers aren't supposed to install them anymore, according to my mates who are in the trade. I have a nice sized one I was going to install, needs a refurb though. I think it was 3-4kw into water and 5kw into the room. Useful for just doing hot tap water.

 

[Brad93]

Well, there is technically only one and a half coal stations left, so that wouldn’t take much effort and ratcliffe is due to shut next year anyway, so end of next year there will be three units at drax (albeit the same output as the four at ratcliffe).

If the government really wanted to go down the coal fired route, and had a station build with efficiency at heart, a well designed system with lots of heat recovery systems and all the modern turbine designs could easily be at least as efficient as the modern gas stations. Same with central heating systems, heat recovery could easily heat a water tank.
Uk has some of the best coal around… problem with open cast is there isn’t enough real estate in this country to dig a big hole. Germany’s lignite mines are epic. A quick google shows three cover a combined area of nearly 100 square miles. Suppose there’s plenty of space in wales…

Yes i know they're planning to shut ratcliffe because we had the contract to hardface another 16 coal grinding/pulverising rings and they've pulled the plug.