I use Fordopedia a lot for this kind of thing but the drawings are distinctly lacking in this department. In the obvious diagram they actually show a wheel arch liner for the XR4i but I've never seen such a thing on any UK cars.
- Thread starter Domdom
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Doing a bit more this afternoon and I discovered, as I suspected I might, that poxy fuel filler is in the wrong place. Too far forward by about 5/16ths.
It turns out the repair section for the wing is either the wrong size, which isn’t uncommon, or it’s an over panel.
I decided to try and refit the bit I cut out since that absolutely is the right place for it, and a few expletives were uttered. The height is fine, damn near perfect but in the lateral plane it’s way off. Bugger
Anyway, I now have a cunning plan. I’m going to re-use the original bit I cut out and just use the bit of the repair section needed to rebuild the rusty bits. Of course I will have to re-do the inner panel for the 3rd time but it keeps me out of bother.
It turns out the repair section for the wing is either the wrong size, which isn’t uncommon, or it’s an over panel.
I decided to try and refit the bit I cut out since that absolutely is the right place for it, and a few expletives were uttered. The height is fine, damn near perfect but in the lateral plane it’s way off. Bugger
Anyway, I now have a cunning plan. I’m going to re-use the original bit I cut out and just use the bit of the repair section needed to rebuild the rusty bits. Of course I will have to re-do the inner panel for the 3rd time but it keeps me out of bother.
KemppiFrog
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Just seen this..
Had an XR 4x4i for a bit in '89. Did Algarve to Cambridge at over the national speed limits on average... including stops. Very quick machine.
( Not a chance nowadays if you want to keep your licence (and car..)
Had an XR 4x4i for a bit in '89. Did Algarve to Cambridge at over the national speed limits on average... including stops. Very quick machine.
( Not a chance nowadays if you want to keep your licence (and car..)
Well, I did a bit more last night. Had a hellish day at work and doing this stuff clears my head as all good hobbies should.
Revisiting that fuel filler I decided to cut out a part and make a patch to weld in. All good. I'll tidy up the welding later tonight.
Then I tacked in the old wing part that I had cut out previously, complete with the fuel cap recess tacked back on to it. I scribed the mounting holes and applied a bit of blue spray paint through the cap recess just to avoid losing any scribe marks followed by undoing the tack welds and removing the old wing part. One hole saw and 2 6mm drilled holes later and it's now in the right place.
Then I had to remove the fuel cap recess from the old wing and attach it to the repair panel. I won't use the whole panel as it's a shocking fit. But I will use enough of it to replace all the rotten bits and that which I cut out. The back end of the panel is a good 3/16" (4.5mm to all you spring chickens) too long though, one very large gap where it wraps round to meet the rear panel.
I think tonight I will focus on finishing the welding on that patch, applying some zinc primer and then cutting the repair section to fit the bits I need. I don't like this multiple spot welding when the metal is good enough to seam weld but heat distortion is a real PITA. I genuinely wonder how the old skool boys manage to Oxy/Acet and hammer weld stuff without it all distorting.
Revisiting that fuel filler I decided to cut out a part and make a patch to weld in. All good. I'll tidy up the welding later tonight.
Then I tacked in the old wing part that I had cut out previously, complete with the fuel cap recess tacked back on to it. I scribed the mounting holes and applied a bit of blue spray paint through the cap recess just to avoid losing any scribe marks followed by undoing the tack welds and removing the old wing part. One hole saw and 2 6mm drilled holes later and it's now in the right place.
Then I had to remove the fuel cap recess from the old wing and attach it to the repair panel. I won't use the whole panel as it's a shocking fit. But I will use enough of it to replace all the rotten bits and that which I cut out. The back end of the panel is a good 3/16" (4.5mm to all you spring chickens) too long though, one very large gap where it wraps round to meet the rear panel.
I think tonight I will focus on finishing the welding on that patch, applying some zinc primer and then cutting the repair section to fit the bits I need. I don't like this multiple spot welding when the metal is good enough to seam weld but heat distortion is a real PITA. I genuinely wonder how the old skool boys manage to Oxy/Acet and hammer weld stuff without it all distorting.
Had a couple of hours free today so thought I would tackle the driver’s side sill and floor. First thing was to weld a brace across the bottom of the door opening. I’ll have to add to this as I cut more out.
What I’m finding is that there will he a definite sequence to reassemble this lot, especially getting the inner sill in the right place.
Anyway, gradually cutting bits out and I got to this lot. Some rebuilding to do before I’m ready to start cutting out more. Mostly the jacking point reinforcement and front of the floor.
What I’m finding is that there will he a definite sequence to reassemble this lot, especially getting the inner sill in the right place.
Anyway, gradually cutting bits out and I got to this lot. Some rebuilding to do before I’m ready to start cutting out more. Mostly the jacking point reinforcement and front of the floor.
Onoff
In the land of the unfinished project I am King!
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There's more box here if you need it!
That’s really useful steel as it goes. Much appreciated and I can feel something creative coming on once this rust relic is finished with it.
Onoff
In the land of the unfinished project I am King!
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You might think about building a ring roller...or two...
slim_boy_fat
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It’s been a slow day, super tired after waiting up for Mrs DomDom to het home. Big crash on the A5 meaning she didn’t get in until gone 1.00 but the dogs don’t understand this when the want out for a leak at 6.00
I did make a repair bit for the rotted front floor though. Starting from this
got to this,
and then started trimming and shaping the jack point reinforcement repair
I’ve not welded it in yet cos I have to get the inner sill out and this might get in the way And I reckon the seam where it meets the wheel arch needs a repair section due to it being thin and rusty. Knocked off now but I did have a good tidy up before retiring to coffee.
I think a decent night’s sleep will see more progress tomorrow. Need to get some more bracing in place and start pulling the inner sill out.
I did make a repair bit for the rotted front floor though. Starting from this
got to this,
and then started trimming and shaping the jack point reinforcement repair
I’ve not welded it in yet cos I have to get the inner sill out and this might get in the way And I reckon the seam where it meets the wheel arch needs a repair section due to it being thin and rusty. Knocked off now but I did have a good tidy up before retiring to coffee.
I think a decent night’s sleep will see more progress tomorrow. Need to get some more bracing in place and start pulling the inner sill out.
Nice morning this morning, so of course SWMBO wanted me to take her to the designer outlets in Cannock I dutifully obliged.
After a spot of lunch I mooched on down to the workshop and started on really getting serious with this inner sill.
Started with extra bracing. Top to bottom of door, then a cross brace to the transmission tunnel, and then one underneath tying the front chassis rail to a rear suspension mount.
So then I set about the sill in sections. The outer sill had to come off to get to the inner due to the way it’s assembled once you get behind the B post. I also cut out the bad bit of the floor. That was no simple task either due to all the over plates done by the previous repairs.
Front part of the inner sill removed.
Then this seems to be a strengthening piece at the front of the inner sill but not replicated on the panels I have. Need to repair the top section.
Cleaned up the central floor box section ready for the new inner sill to weld to.
Then turned my attention to the back section. There are 4 skins welded together here, the inner floor, inner sill, some other panel I have to re-make where I cut off the rusty bits (that won't be simple) and then the centre sill. You can also see the jacking point brace which is welded to the inner sill but again, not replicated on the new panels. Took some butchery to get it off but it will bash flat again to be re-fixed.
That's all for now.
I dutifully obliged.After a spot of lunch I mooched on down to the workshop and started on really getting serious with this inner sill.
Started with extra bracing. Top to bottom of door, then a cross brace to the transmission tunnel, and then one underneath tying the front chassis rail to a rear suspension mount.
So then I set about the sill in sections. The outer sill had to come off to get to the inner due to the way it’s assembled once you get behind the B post. I also cut out the bad bit of the floor. That was no simple task either due to all the over plates done by the previous repairs.
Front part of the inner sill removed.
Then this seems to be a strengthening piece at the front of the inner sill but not replicated on the panels I have. Need to repair the top section.
Cleaned up the central floor box section ready for the new inner sill to weld to.
Then turned my attention to the back section. There are 4 skins welded together here, the inner floor, inner sill, some other panel I have to re-make where I cut off the rusty bits (that won't be simple) and then the centre sill. You can also see the jacking point brace which is welded to the inner sill but again, not replicated on the new panels. Took some butchery to get it off but it will bash flat again to be re-fixed.
That's all for now.
it sort of is if you consider the brace underneath. That ties the floor to a fixed dimension then across the bottom of the door gives a similar fix in a slightly different plane, then top to bottom stops it moving in that direction and the brace to the tunnel keeps it at the correct distance from the tunnel. When I cut the sill out it didn't move, no nasty 'ping' as the last bit was cut through. I measured it against the other door opening at several strategic points and they are both the same. The proof of the pudding will be refitting the door afterwards. The pre-cutting test fit was good.
With a full X brace it would really hamper access to that inner sill which is why I did what you see. Although now the sill is out there's no reason I couldn't add a bit more bracing, but I really don't think it needs it.
Did a bit more today, mainly removal of the old inner sill and some fettling to see how the replacement fits. Of course I found more rot in the leading lower edge of the OSF rear wheel arch. Hey, Henry Ford invented rust.
Trial fit.
OK from above
Not bad from below. Jacking point reinforcement is about 3/8" out though. I measured the captive nut for the seat belt from the main crossmember each side to be sure the sill is in the right place.
That bent back jacking point reinforcement is the old one and it tends to agree with my measuring.
Then we come to the centre sill, which for all the world looks wrong to me. The thing simply will not fit. But when I look at it there are 2 curves in the flat edge which I would normally assume line up with the B post. If I am correct this panel is for a 4 door, not a 2 door. The label on it suggests nothing and the website part number indicates Sierra Mk1 with no reference to 4 door or 2 door. What do the collective think?
Coffee time now and some research.
Trial fit.
OK from above
Not bad from below. Jacking point reinforcement is about 3/8" out though. I measured the captive nut for the seat belt from the main crossmember each side to be sure the sill is in the right place.
That bent back jacking point reinforcement is the old one and it tends to agree with my measuring.
Then we come to the centre sill, which for all the world looks wrong to me. The thing simply will not fit. But when I look at it there are 2 curves in the flat edge which I would normally assume line up with the B post. If I am correct this panel is for a 4 door, not a 2 door. The label on it suggests nothing and the website part number indicates Sierra Mk1 with no reference to 4 door or 2 door. What do the collective think?
Coffee time now and some research.
Well, a coffee and a cigar combined with a good coat of thinking about and I have it sussed.
It is indeed a 4 door panel but if I cut off those B post tags it will fit just fine.
Now I also know the sequence for reassembly.
clean up and repair all the lips which the inner sill have to be welded to.
Fit inner sill.
straighten and repair the inner side panel which the old jacking point is welded to. This has to be extended back to the bottom edge of the inner sill.
Then the centre sill goes over that and lastly the outer sill.
As my dead old Dad used to say, what a bloody faff!
It is indeed a 4 door panel but if I cut off those B post tags it will fit just fine.
Now I also know the sequence for reassembly.
clean up and repair all the lips which the inner sill have to be welded to.
Fit inner sill.
straighten and repair the inner side panel which the old jacking point is welded to. This has to be extended back to the bottom edge of the inner sill.
Then the centre sill goes over that and lastly the outer sill.
As my dead old Dad used to say, what a bloody faff!
Jeepers your deep now. I would be afraid to go that far incase I made a mess, one panel at a time yes, but multiple panels and bracing etc. I could soon get lost.
Your getting me in the mood for an old ford again. Problem is when I spend loads of time getting it right I cant be bothered and sell it coz its impossible to get it perfect.
The last sierra I had on the spit was nearly finished with welding. Looking beautiful and when cleaning up ready for painting I poked another hole. It lay for a year and friend wanted spit back so I trailed it across the yard with tractor and took to scrap yard. For the bare shell I barely got enough to bring home a length of angle iron.
Your getting me in the mood for an old ford again. Problem is when I spend loads of time getting it right I cant be bothered and sell it coz its impossible to get it perfect.
The last sierra I had on the spit was nearly finished with welding. Looking beautiful and when cleaning up ready for painting I poked another hole. It lay for a year and friend wanted spit back so I trailed it across the yard with tractor and took to scrap yard. For the bare shell I barely got enough to bring home a length of angle iron.
Well, this thread has many photographs which help as a reference if I need it. I use the original photos mostly as my gauge. Generally though it's just a case of thinking it through. Not hard, just get the sequence right. Kind of like "you can't wash up until you've finished dinner"
I think we have scrap merchants lurking on here so I shall be kind in saying that they are mostly direct descendants of Dick Turpin given half a chance, IMHO of course
. My local guy can be horrific until I challenge him - it's all about the haggle. But he does let me rummage in the various piles for odd bits as long as he doesn't see it officially and I leave some drinking vouchers on the counter.When I say I'm afraid of getting lost, I mean if you remove an outer sill you cant go wrong as you go by the inner sill but when I would cut out a complete sill and have nothing to go by I'd be worried I'd mess it up. For example I've seen places were you go to fix a hole and cut it all out and before you know your 3 panels deep.Well, this thread has many photographs which help as a reference if I need it. I use the original photos mostly as my gauge. Generally though it's just a case of thinking it through. Not hard, just get the sequence right. Kind of like "you can't wash up until you've finished dinner"
I think we have scrap merchants lurking on here so I shall be kind in saying that they are mostly direct descendants of Dick Turpin given half a chance, IMHO of course
Ah yes, loads of measuring from specific reference points, writing it all down (that's the key) and when refitting stuff do a trial fit, measure it all at least 3 times. When you're happy take a permanent marker and draw reference lines everywhere so you can line it all up again really easily.
So my brother came to visit yesterday for a bit of a play, was a fine day indeed. Made some progress on the XR4 as well.
Bringing the thread up to date, the inner sill was welded in. I had to remove the jack point reinforcement and move it about 3/8". All tacked in position ready to re-check all the measurements. Still wasn't happy with it so took it off again and moved it another 1/4" to line up with the original.
You can see the inner panel which I had to but down to get rid of the rot, well that was the original centre sill as well. Quite fortunate as I now don't have to repair it, I can fit the replacement centre sill and then trim it further and weld to the new centre.
Also repaired the bottom edge of the front centre part as well.
Turned my attention to the inside area at the back. Some tacks and then plug welded in. I found another bit of very dubious steel when the back of the inner sill meets the wheel arch so this was cut our after trying to weld a seam. Just blowing through some lace thin metal. I also found the sill is a different shape to the original as the plate which anchors it to the seat crossmember is now sitting in fresh air, so I have to make something to bridge that gap.
So trial fitting the outer sill revealed that these supposedly high quality panels are not so good a fit. I expect fettling but there are some serious gaps to address.
Turning our attention to the front jacking point where I had previously cut out 2/3rds of it to get rid of rot we not had to prep the area and the repair section to fit. My brother took some of these photos so I don't have them all. But had to sort the front wheelarch seam out, prep it all under the repair section with zinc primer and in she went.
That's the 10 photo limit so I'll make another post.
Bringing the thread up to date, the inner sill was welded in. I had to remove the jack point reinforcement and move it about 3/8". All tacked in position ready to re-check all the measurements. Still wasn't happy with it so took it off again and moved it another 1/4" to line up with the original.
You can see the inner panel which I had to but down to get rid of the rot, well that was the original centre sill as well. Quite fortunate as I now don't have to repair it, I can fit the replacement centre sill and then trim it further and weld to the new centre.
Also repaired the bottom edge of the front centre part as well.
Turned my attention to the inside area at the back. Some tacks and then plug welded in. I found another bit of very dubious steel when the back of the inner sill meets the wheel arch so this was cut our after trying to weld a seam. Just blowing through some lace thin metal. I also found the sill is a different shape to the original as the plate which anchors it to the seat crossmember is now sitting in fresh air, so I have to make something to bridge that gap.
So trial fitting the outer sill revealed that these supposedly high quality panels are not so good a fit. I expect fettling but there are some serious gaps to address.
Turning our attention to the front jacking point where I had previously cut out 2/3rds of it to get rid of rot we not had to prep the area and the repair section to fit. My brother took some of these photos so I don't have them all. But had to sort the front wheelarch seam out, prep it all under the repair section with zinc primer and in she went.
That's the 10 photo limit so I'll make another post.
