it probably is ,,,, ive not had great results with weld through primer ,,,, i still find it needs cleaning back to get the quality in plug welds that I like ,,, Ive used acf for ten tears or more now , and find it works for me ,,,,, I like kent products too and a few others ,,, but when i have to stand by my work I use what I trust . the best thing about acf is that it wont catch fire if you do need to be back in the area ,,,, lots of folk will have their own favorite products too ,,, I stick with what Im used to ,,,, but never ever ever will I use waxol , or used motor oil.
- Thread starter HSGB
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Once you start digging the rust is always worse than you think and as mentioned above. For a decent lasting job you need to cut all the rusty metal out. I recently did that job on my VW van sill but there are no N/S aftermarket outer panels available for T5. (Plenty of O/S repair panels.) Mine was quite a complicated shape and well beyond my meagre skills to fabricate so I ended up using a salvage body cut. I butt welded the outside part and overlapped the underneath. There was a handy row of rubber plugged holes (half of) which came with my *new* panel. I just pumped in loads of waxoyl afterwards. I am going to keep this up each year.
i schutz ot two pack the outside , or get it painted back to original if its something expensive , the last sill repair I did was an Aston DB7 it was put back to the original body protection and paint ,,, then it came back and both sills were done front to back inside with acf the holes I drilled for access on the back end of the sill and front inner edge got rubber grommets put in , that way the sills can have another dose of acf in a couple of years [ 2 mots] time . the grommets look factory and no ones worrying about whats festering inside the box section.
Bryan Williams
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I have the bodge equivalent, a lidl multitool..
given the choice i would go die grinder before power file ,,,, same sort of price if you have air ,,, not a level playing field if you need electric power ,,,, both great tools , both very versatile ... but a die grinder will strip paint and underseal a lot faster and shape holes easier and fit into tight corners better ,,,, you would go through a lot of belts for the price of one decent burr
keithski122
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If its a bodge patch just to get it through the mot then theres no need to go through the hassle of trying to joggle that area, the only person to see it will be the mot tester so cut a patch put two 90 degree bends in it, spot/plug weld the bottom and seam the rest.
To be honest I would never let a joggler anywhere near something I was welding, to much chance of holding moisture.
keithski122, seriously, I have seen patches laid on top of the parent metal on the underside of cars that are still sound after seven years. How come it is considered a bodge? What's the alternative, to cut out a certain shaped orifice and make a plate to fit exactly within the opening, and flush, with butt welds all around? Do you ever put in backing strips that lap the joint from behind?
ajlelectronics
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That is my technique 100% of the time. It only takes slightly longer to make a nice looking job out of it. It may not be visible, but I know what it looks like. You would be hard pressed to know where I had been.
keithski122
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I've actually done loads of work like that, people want a cheap repair to get it through an mot, slap a patch on and weld it up.Its a repair that will get it through an mot but for how many years I wouldn't guess. If it was mine I would cut out the rusty metal and seam weld a sedction in, no lap joints to hold water and would last far longer if treated inside and out. Its all down to who is paying and how much they want to pay.
Depends on the car. Rotten old van slap a patch on outside no fanning about. It's probably going to see a scrapyard in the next 10 years. Not worth putting the effort in.
I use bog standard beige Etch primer afterwards. Try and get as far as I can around the back ect. Sometimes I'll just use hammerite. Depending what's kicking around. Might underseal it afterwards but the price of that nowadays I just leave it painted and not bother.
I use bog standard beige Etch primer afterwards. Try and get as far as I can around the back ect. Sometimes I'll just use hammerite. Depending what's kicking around. Might underseal it afterwards but the price of that nowadays I just leave it painted and not bother.
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premmington
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I too have done alot of this type of "fast patching". Two or three years and the plate will fall off as the metal around it degrades.
Restoration welding and patching for an MOT - are two defined different processes!
gaz1, is that your van? That's a serious amount of welding! Surely for someone to have all that work done it will cost more than what the van is worth? I suppose it can be easier than trying to get another van though.
Yes, I think I am going to actually cut it out and put a piece in flush. I will have to find out how far back I need to go before hitting decent steel, now though.
Yes, I think I am going to actually cut it out and put a piece in flush. I will have to find out how far back I need to go before hitting decent steel, now though.
hotponyshoes
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Can't you get replacement sill panels for it?
I've got the same job to do on a van of mine this winter. A quick look suggests aftermarket sills are only about £30-40 each so my plan was to grab a couple of those, use them to show me where the spot welds are, drill out the welds, remove the old sills, powerfile the rust off the mating surfaces, spot the others back on.
I do have a spot welder but I'll probably just use the mig as I need that out for a patch on a jacking point as well.
Due to the age of the van already I'm not going to get obsessed with the best ways of rust treatment. I'm thinking that I'll wire brush off wherever I have burnt the primer on the new sills, rattle can that over with etch, smear some seam sealer round the edges then dose it all thick with white stonechip.
If I can do the whole job in an afternoon for under £100 I won't mind if it needs doing again in 10yrs time as I'm not expecting the van to last that long anyway!
I've got the same job to do on a van of mine this winter. A quick look suggests aftermarket sills are only about £30-40 each so my plan was to grab a couple of those, use them to show me where the spot welds are, drill out the welds, remove the old sills, powerfile the rust off the mating surfaces, spot the others back on.
I do have a spot welder but I'll probably just use the mig as I need that out for a patch on a jacking point as well.
Due to the age of the van already I'm not going to get obsessed with the best ways of rust treatment. I'm thinking that I'll wire brush off wherever I have burnt the primer on the new sills, rattle can that over with etch, smear some seam sealer round the edges then dose it all thick with white stonechip.
If I can do the whole job in an afternoon for under £100 I won't mind if it needs doing again in 10yrs time as I'm not expecting the van to last that long anyway!
i don't get replacement panels very often. only if they would be awkward to make. or too far gone to get a template off.
i've had a look for some past pictures, only found one. this is before welding (notice the piece of crappy plate i'm using as a heat shield behind) air box tied up with rope. ready to go. this was the final one. i thought i might of had one of the step i built up for it with about 3ft x 2ft of floor piece (the drivers seat was going through the floor) but thats pretty much all the prep work i do. few folds and stick it on. the V gap i just fill jumping with over with rod. ill get a long prybar where it meets the inner wing, push that in with my shoulder.
i've had a look for some past pictures, only found one. this is before welding (notice the piece of crappy plate i'm using as a heat shield behind) air box tied up with rope. ready to go. this was the final one. i thought i might of had one of the step i built up for it with about 3ft x 2ft of floor piece (the drivers seat was going through the floor) but thats pretty much all the prep work i do. few folds and stick it on. the V gap i just fill jumping with over with rod. ill get a long prybar where it meets the inner wing, push that in with my shoulder.
It's grown arms and legs!
I only took it in my garage to replace a ball-joint, fuel return pipe and the two brake pipes to the rear; then to give it a cleandown and underseal. Now it's getting ugly!
Seems to definitely be coming from inside. I noticed there is very little run on the bottom of the sills, almost horizontal to the road, literally acting like a catchment tray. All these lying videos of Fords being plunged into tanks of anti-rust primers and paints, the bloody metal is totally bare in there. There is a micro coating to the exterior faces but nowt internally.
I am going to have to get very familiar with my new welder now, that's for sure, or else this van is off to the fridge factory.
Hotponyshoes, yes I can get outer cills for this van, ranging from £200.00 a pair for full properly pressed and around £40.00 for shorter ones that are just folded steel sheet. I do not think there is anything for the inner sill though and there does not seem to be any rust on the outer cill. Something else I noticed is that the N/S seems to have been effected far worse than the O/S, must be all the poo led at the side of the road, near the verge, etc.
Full: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/37400075...GUu3FpdB/YPcH6LTc6WsLw7pQpu4|tkp:BFBM7q_Y8_9g
Plain sheet: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/28499381...dcK0lJqC8AdGb1v7Ssn91v65IR1Q|tkp:BFBM7K_Y8_9g
I only took it in my garage to replace a ball-joint, fuel return pipe and the two brake pipes to the rear; then to give it a cleandown and underseal. Now it's getting ugly!
Seems to definitely be coming from inside. I noticed there is very little run on the bottom of the sills, almost horizontal to the road, literally acting like a catchment tray. All these lying videos of Fords being plunged into tanks of anti-rust primers and paints, the bloody metal is totally bare in there. There is a micro coating to the exterior faces but nowt internally.
I am going to have to get very familiar with my new welder now, that's for sure, or else this van is off to the fridge factory.
Hotponyshoes, yes I can get outer cills for this van, ranging from £200.00 a pair for full properly pressed and around £40.00 for shorter ones that are just folded steel sheet. I do not think there is anything for the inner sill though and there does not seem to be any rust on the outer cill. Something else I noticed is that the N/S seems to have been effected far worse than the O/S, must be all the poo led at the side of the road, near the verge, etc.
Full: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/37400075...GUu3FpdB/YPcH6LTc6WsLw7pQpu4|tkp:BFBM7q_Y8_9g
Plain sheet: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/28499381...dcK0lJqC8AdGb1v7Ssn91v65IR1Q|tkp:BFBM7K_Y8_9g
Gods thats not too bad at all ,,, keep cleaning .. I think when I do that sort of job theres only about 10% of the time I spend welding ,,, its all in the cleaning and the fit upIt's grown arms and legs!
I only took it in my garage to replace a ball-joint, fuel return pipe and the two brake pipes to the rear; then to give it a cleandown and underseal. Now it's getting ugly!
Seems to definitely be coming from inside. I noticed there is very little run on the bottom of the sills, almost horizontal to the road, literally acting like a catchment tray. All these lying videos of Fords being plunged into tanks of anti-rust primers and paints, the bloody metal is totally bare in there. There is a micro coating to the exterior faces but nowt internally.
I am going to have to get very familiar with my new welder now, that's for sure, or else this van is off to the fridge factory.
Hotponyshoes, yes I can get outer cills for this van, ranging from £200.00 a pair for full properly pressed and around £40.00 for shorter ones that are just folded steel sheet. I do not think there is anything for the inner sill though and there does not seem to be any rust on the outer cill. Something else I noticed is that the N/S seems to have been effected far worse than the O/S, must be all the poo led at the side of the road, near the verge, etc.
Full: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/374000753684?hash=item57142e9c14:g:rMwAAOSwkQpjQr61&amdata=enc:AQAHAAAA4LphuksHBkFBOQdoVXrN4a/Bgpzrow3iB4qx/iBAdsTI51B4ZPsOKJxvArolUbemLdI3t+Vl2Ilj48s19RFgMEfY8K/ZpR9eGKmYYrEqN/wrVLAv3uSzn3AAusK2CeyN8CxBk5bje/Fbo0PmzB+Qk67NEJcCf4YVl/aC48U9ljfI5d7ff/2Df6LIgH4Ie9vmjjKj7W64alg1mVxiDytt+OpnjnZ2ROM9GVkXA6t8T9w7CuDa1YjFTgdEWewduTgSjOmt6T9AovTqF4izGUu3FpdB/YPcH6LTc6WsLw7pQpu4|tkp:BFBM7q_Y8_9g
Plain sheet: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/284993814458?hash=item425af47fba:goIAAOSw1S9WcVfp&amdata=enc:AQAHAAAA4CZ7kCahrxw+TTB6QIrcSpMaVemszNbsCZItMhEgw/r6nEDbOxF452/je1wxIQKNCQYMHRTLPNpS7X0R0QLwCra8mAi8VyV6zsbIxtjCu7UOtgUH5iS7063bZLQkppGzGfUsMenFJO9UlYaXNXkHm7apWnuiGEgsYeM4el+BXZaSP91F+rPY7ZuLIl1eiYkKri2NVfOycdvHzX1m7CMYjXI5ovIn9uZ9am1O4HqyZnfC3ioQXjeXE/sIBFWY1p3RYFc+ZNjbooY1G7jidcK0lJqC8AdGb1v7Ssn91v65IR1Q|tkp:BFBM7K_Y8_9g
2003 transit 2.4 t350, the hole is where the washer bottle neck goes.
