Welding/fixture table

[grim_d]

What size holes are they please? I may do for mine.

16 or 28mm

So the etch lines and holes are lasered rather than machined? Interesting. So this is basically about the same level of quality as the Mac tables then.

Certainly looks the part and 0.3mm is pretty flat over that size.

On the eco model (which this is) they are, on the plus and pro models the holes are machined and chamfered.

Even at retail price this is actually cheaper than a Mac table of the same quality (though these are 8mm rather than 6mm).

I'd say it's probably a bit higher quality than Mac, having watched Jason's (fireball) video on welding tables the jigsaw style tables seem to be a bit of a "wet noodle" in comparison (though perfectly good for most work)

That being said. I've no experience of Mac tables so it's certainly not my opinion.

Interestingly the flatness results he got from the siegmund tables were pretty poor considering the cost.

 

[Brad93]

16 or 28mm



On the eco model (which this is) they are, on the plus and pro models the holes are machined and chamfered.

Even at retail price this is actually cheaper than a Mac table of the same quality (though these are 8mm rather than 6mm).

I'd say it's probably a bit higher quality than Mac, having watched Jason's (fireball) video on welding tables the jigsaw style tables seem to be a bit of a "wet noodle" in comparison (though perfectly good for most work)

That being said. I've no experience of Mac tables so it's certainly not my opinion.

Interestingly the flatness results he got from the siegmund tables were pretty poor considering the cost.

I've not watched that video (can't stand the bloke to be quite honest).

I think siegmund are meant to be +/- 0.5mm over the whole table which on a 3m table would be quite good.

If it wasn't up to scratch I'd quite frankly send it back. £8k table needs to be perfect in my opinion.

What's the other brand. Demeller?

 

[8ob]

Am I the only one using an engineers slotted table as a welding bench? Got a couple of these for next to nothing, a gurt one which lives out for the clunky stuff and a neat little 6x4 for in the workshop. Not much you cant do on one of these.

 

[Brad93]

Actually I say I can't stand the guy, I actually like his table video where he made his own and tested the flatness with piano wire. I don't like the worlds largest vice, the worlds biggest Cincinnati mill etc etc videos. YouTube clickbait.

 

[Brad93]

I've just found the video.

Looks like the siegmund system 28 is 0.005" / 0.127mm over 94" / 2400mm.

The system 16 looked like a pile of dog doo. Certainly buy the GPPH over the siegmund if that's your budget.

In regards to the system 28, For a milled table, that's flipping good going. There's only two ways of getting that flatter, a slide way grinder or a planer, and i don't know of anything that big in the UK.

Clive @pressbrake1?

What would plough grinding achieve, maybe 5-10 thou

 

[grim_d]

I've just found the video.

Looks like the siegmund system 28 is 0.005" / 0.127mm over 94" / 2400mm.

The system 16 looked like a pile of dog doo. Certainly buy the GPPH over the siegmund if that's your budget.

In regards to the system 28, For a milled table, that's flipping good going. There's only two ways of getting that flatter, a slide way grinder or a planer, and i don't know of anything that big in the UK.

Clive @pressbrake1?

What would plough grinding achieve, maybe 5-10 thou

Yeah I was talking about the system 16 one, disapointing at best.

The system 28 was a thing of beauty.

The weldsend was a different league...that's seriously big weldment stuff.

Buildpro seemed good value.

Certiflat was guff.

The ones with the sections are interesting because the plates can be ground and everything can be shimmed to perfect flatness if necessary as well as being replaceable.

At the end of the day though, even the worst welding fixture table is better than a timber table.

I'm seriously thinking about having a frame made up similar to a welding table but without a top and putting an MFT MDF top on it for my cabinet making, you wouldn't think it bit for high end cabinet making having a bench that's not (relatively) flat is a nightmare.

 

[Woody.v8]

I've just found the video.

Looks like the siegmund system 28 is 0.005" / 0.127mm over 94" / 2400mm.

The system 16 looked like a pile of dog doo. Certainly buy the GPPH over the siegmund if that's your budget.

In regards to the system 28, For a milled table, that's flipping good going. There's only two ways of getting that flatter, a slide way grinder or a planer, and i don't know of anything that big in the UK.

Clive @pressbrake1?

What would plough grinding achieve, maybe 5-10 thou

He has a new video out today with his new cast table, it looks very nice.

 

[grim_d]

He has a new video out today with his new cast table, it looks very nice.

My only issue with his own brand table is that he's decided to go outwith the industry standards holes sizes....the cynic in me sees reasons other than "because it's better".

I bet it's incredible though.

 

[Brad93]

My only issue with his own brand table is that he's decided to go outwith the industry standards holes sizes....the cynic in me sees reasons other than "because it's better".

I bet it's incredible though.

Can't blame him. Have you seen the cost of the tooling. More than the table.

What he has basically produced though is already available. Ebay Grade B layout table/Surface Table/layout floor plate. The only difference is the accurate hole spacing. If you know someone with a big elgamill or horizontal borer that's not out of the question to have done.

 

[grim_d]

Can't blame him. Have you seen the cost of the tooling. More than the table.

What he has basically produced though is already available. Ebay Grade B layout table/Surface Table/layout floor plate. The only difference is the accurate hole spacing. If you know someone with a big elgamill or horizontal borer that's not out of the question to have done.

Yeah it's atrocious how expensive it is...it's like the drinks in a restaurant though.

A lot of it can be home made however without too much effort. Particularly if you have a lathe.

 

[mtt.tr]

He's wrong, cast isn't necessarily more rigid.

Proper design will easily be as stiff.

And machine are cast because it's cheaper than weldment especially in bulk

 

[pressbrake1]

Abom has managed to ponce one

You can get a bedding plate and drill and ream holes in it but the bracing on the underside is all over the place, well I should say the bracing or ribs are best placed for rigidity not convenience on fixture holes.
I know this because I’ve got half a dozen to put on the devlieg and convert to fixture tables.

 

[grim_d]

He's wrong, cast isn't necessarily more rigid.

Proper design will easily be as stiff.

And machine are cast because it's cheaper than weldment especially in bulk

Aren't machines cast iron because it's also considerably better at absorbing vibration than steel?

 

[grim_d]

Abom has managed to ponce one

Stopped watching him not long after he left motion. All about that YouTube money now and the content suffers.

 

[mtt.tr]

Aren't machines cast iron because it's also considerably better at absorbing vibration than steel?

Yes but it also lucky convenience, you can use proper engineering to achieve the same with steel epoxy granite or such

It's another step with additional cost

 

[pressbrake1]

He's wrong, cast isn't necessarily more rigid.

Proper design will easily be as stiff.

And machine are cast because it's cheaper than weldment especially in bulk

No , cast is much more expensive , the days of cheap energy are long gone and far more structurally stable
When I made machines for a living we used weldments because it was cheaper and the ways were bolted on toolsteel or linear bearings so no need for iron.
To combat the harmonics they were massive constructions
Cincinnati tried hollow weldments on the sabre and arrow. Those **Language**ers sing with a decent cut

 

[pressbrake1]

Yes but it also lucky convenience, you can use proper engineering to achieve the same with steel epoxy granite or such

It's another step with additional cost

No all machines are convenient to fill with epoxy concrete as there are mechanisms inside etc
They use stress and harmonic analysis with casting design. Not many castings other than mine are by eye, guessing and luck

 

[grim_d]

Yes but it also lucky convenience, you can use proper engineering to achieve the same with steel epoxy granite or such

It's another step with additional cost

I certainly wouldn't want an epoxy granite weld table

He goes on and on about spatter not sticking to cast too...don't know how accurate that is?

 

[pressbrake1]

I certainly wouldn't want an epoxy granite weld table

He goes on and on about spatter not sticking to cast too...don't know how accurate that is?

It does damage the surface but doesn’t stick as hard. I know this from welding a fixture mounted to the devlieg

 

[mtt.tr]

I certainly wouldn't want an epoxy granite weld table

He goes on and on about spatter not sticking to cast too...don't know how accurate that is?

You mentioned harmonics