what to do to make welds better

[BChild]

i am using an argon mix and i dont have a garage to get inside
if you look at my gauge i had that set to 8 bar instead of 2 yesterday and still had the brown residue
im doing butt welds and the inside of the original panel has waxoil on it would that have any effect

I'm not familiar with those guages but stand by my previous comments that without knowing exactly what flow rate you have it's hard to know if you've got a problem elsewhere - it could be waxoil coming thro the weld but I don't know.

I have two argoshild guages and they have l/min on them - both need to be set at differnt places and for either of them the actual flow thro a flowmeter isn't the same as the guage suggests - that's why I use a flowmeter - if I'm inside the garage with windows and doors shut I can reduce the flow down to 7 l/min and it seems fine - doors and windows open in this lovely weather we are having and I need to turn the flow up to 10 l/min

 

[BChild]

and i forgot i also had the wire sticking to the tip quite a bit but it released itself after a few seconds but long enough for the weld pool to cool down and it looked like a flame was forming in the shroud now and then

is your shroud clean and clear of splatter - that can affect the flow and direction of the shielding gas

If the wire is sticking to the tip I would have said the wire speed is too slow?

 

[richard s]

i went out today and had a little bit more practice
front

back

then i went back to minimum setting and had wire speed between 5 and 6
front

back

 

[BChild]

How thin is that metal?

 

[richard s]

the metal is 1mm thick
im nearly out of wire so once i get some more i will whack it on the next power level and have some more practice
just an afterthought would 0.8mm wire be any better for a beginner instead of 0.6mm

 

[series2]

your test piece looks not too bad, but welding rusty cars is an a**e at the best of times.

judging from the holes in the butt weld, a little too much current or not moving fast enough. on 1mm, it should be (quite) easy to run a weave without blowing holes, but saying that, I still manage to do it.

0.6 or 0.8? I prefer 0.8, but then my welder is only 90A, and it allows me to get a bit more out of it plus my welder's lowest setting is ridiculously low, thicker wire = higher current for a given setting, and a slightly lower wire feed speed. If you want to weld to thin stuff (<0.8mm) stick to 0.6 wire.

As for the gas flow, I set mine by ear, works for me as my reg has only got bottle pressure (machine mart tat). Start with it too high, turn down gradually until you start to get spatter, turn it back up a bit! Judging by the spatter on your test piece, not far off.

Waxoyl is a git! It could well be causing the brown deposit, It wicks out of the seams when heated causing spatter and poor welds, you can try warming the area with a blowlamp, and cleaning down before you start to weld.

 

[richard s]

my welder says its a 130 amp but the sticker on the front says min 40 amps max 80 amps
i think i might try the 0.8mm wire as i think im getting good penetration on my tacks but not when i try doing a run then when i up the power i can still get good tacks but have a tendancy to blow holes with relative ease

 

[richard s]

i went to get some 0.8mm wire on my way to work this morning and the smallest roll they do is 5kg but the guy said to check if my machine will be ok with a 5kg reel before buying and he said to find out it will say in the instructions but i cant seem to find them at the minute is there any other way to find out if my machine will be able to cope with a 5kg reel other than strapping one on and seeing if it breaks
cheers

 

[BChild]

i went to get some 0.8mm wire on my way to work this morning and the smallest roll they do is 5kg but the guy said to check if my machine will be ok with a 5kg reel before buying and he said to find out it will say in the instructions but i cant seem to find them at the minute is there any other way to find out if my machine will be able to cope with a 5kg reel other than strapping one on and seeing if it breaks
cheers

Normally you will need spool adaptors - your welder manual should say if you can use 5Kg reels

 

[richard s]

i did the smart thing and asked my wife if she knew where the instructions were. and she did and the instructions say 0.7-5.0 kg
now this is the bit i keep changing my mind on 0.6mm or 0.8mm i know i struggle with penetration on the lower setting when running a bead but if i swap to 0.8mm will it make the lower setting to powerfull and have me blowing holes on every setting
whats your thoughts on what i should do
cheers

 

[BChild]

i did the smart thing and asked my wife if she knew where the instructions were. and she did and the instructions say 0.7-5.0 kg

Have you got the spool adaptors though

now this is the bit i keep changing my mind on 0.6mm or 0.8mm i know i struggle with penetration on the lower setting when running a bead but if i swap to 0.8mm will it make the lower setting to powerfull and have me blowing holes on every setting
whats your thoughts on what i should do
cheers

I keep a reel of both and swap if I need to depending on the task - what I have found is that as I get more experience and practice I prefer the 0.8mm even on thin stuff - I found this out last night preparing my car for the Le Mans Classic Trip - found I'd ripped a roll bar mount out of the chassis on the last track day - no rot just torn steel - pulled the Portamig out (still set up for 3mm Angle iron on 0.8mm wire) I blew one hole and that was easily and quickly filled in again - when I was just starting swaping to 0.6mm helped a lot when all I was doing was blowing holes

 

[richard s]

apparently my welder already has the ability to take the 5kg reel without the need for adaptors due to a larger flange on the base of the spindle (depending on mental age the last part of that will have a few different meanings)

im going to have a phone around and see if i can find a small reel of 0.8mm as i dont fancy spending £15 to find i cant use it
cheers

and shame on you for making your car want to rip itself to bits rather than have you punish it anymore

 

[richard s]

i managed to get out today and have another go

tacked ok then first section welded nice then rest was spitting (it must be the waxoil as the bottom part when i had finished sounded like i was frying chips)

whats your opinions guys

 

[richard s]

also the closer i tried to get the more the rear suspension pushed my visor down so i couldnt see properly

 

[Fergus]

If you are only looking for the odd reel of 0.8 you should be able to find it at the Halfords you were buying your gas bottles from.

 

[syborg]

hi mate.
i too had similar problems with my panther mig years ago, that used flux core wire with a negative gun, i tried alsorts and only used it for one project then sold it on, i guess i just dont get on with mig, or hobby ones anyway,lol in the end i found that i got on alot better with arc and have even managed to weld up 20 swg steel tube using stop and start method, it almost looked tigged afterwards, that was using 1.6mm rods on 40 amp setting. cars are a pain the bum i must admit, you might be better off trying a good tig welder mate.



all the best

peace

syborg.

 

[syborg]

heres some art work ive done using 1.6mm arc rods on 40 amps.
just to give u an idea of what u can achieve with the old buzz box.
http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=13665

peace

syborg

 

[Chickenjohn]

i managed to get out today and have another go
View attachment 17049
tacked ok then first section welded nice then rest was spitting (it must be the waxoil as the bottom part when i had finished sounded like i was frying chips)
View attachment 17050
whats your opinions guys

That is a lot better than your first attempts. Might I suggest turning the wire speed down a tad, and possibly up one on the power as the welds look a little cold and the bead is a bit high. Grind down what you've done and see what it looks like.

Again, use the thin metal pulse technique to avoid blowing holes. I worked this one out for myself years ago and was pleased to see it on malcolms site here.

http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/thin-metal.htm

Needs to look more like this

This is done by a weave/pause technique. I.E watch the video and you will see the torch being moved across the butt join in very small movements as each pulse weld is peformed. Like this http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/flash/controller-stitch-weld.htm

 

[richard s]

fergus
i found a place near me that does the 0.6 and 0.8 mini reels so bought one of each for now i just need to swap to the 0.8 and give it a go and see how i get on with it
after welding that bit i had a look around and i do have a fair bit to be going at
syborg
i started on flux cored but im on normal wire with argon/co2 gas. i do think im getting better but as i dont get out to play with it much its taking time
chickenjohn
i will try changing settings as you suggest but it will be on scrap not the car to see how i get on with it
i have ground it down and it looks ok i can get behind all of that section with my fingers and can feel it has penetrated through
and that was done using the thin metal technique
cheers for the replies guys

 

[bluenose]

to back up the comments about the flow meter for your gas. My regulator says 30 litres per min whilst my flowmeter says 10liters per min.

I think this happens on mine because the regulator is working out the flow rate from the pressure, and because its adapted to a hobby mig it goes through a really small tube which means you need more pressure to achieve the flow rate.

So don't trust what your reg says....