Climate change, real or no deal.

[daleyd]

mig wælding førüm?

 

[dobbslc]

"Climate change could easily cause that to shift and Britain could end up like Norway."

Right I'm buying one of these,

It it probably won't help matters though

 

[Pete.]

I just read today that they had uncovered some artifacts from a mountain cave occupied by soldiers in WW1 in Italy. All sorts of stuff in there left behind when they abandoned their post. The cave was uncovered because a glacier was receding due to global warming.

What I want to know is how did those soldiers get into that cave right through a glacier 100yrs ago?

 

[brightspark]

Yes but we MUST recycle to meet EU targets - funny how our local councils are still pushing for this.
The ONLY stuff that is fully recyclable is metal.
Even glass just gets crushed for sand blasting media. And to think of all the poor old dears who carefully rinse out their jam jars thinking they are going to be reused

in the glass production a fair bit of cullet has to get put in with the process

 

[fizzy]

Cheers for that. The BMRS which it pulls data from has a whole load more stuff on it.

I couldn't resist - I just had to pull the XML data from BMRS myself, and run some stats on Excel.

You're right enough... if we based wind power forecasts on the month of April, it wouldn't get a look in!

On average, it does fairly well though. If we had more energy storage options, it would balance a lot better.

I am always right
I was going to post a link to the spreadsheet but I didn't think anyone would have the patience. I certainly didn't
And that's the trouble with wind power. IF we had a sensible way to store enough energy for a 3 week lull I would be all in favour of it. Enough batteries to take up the slack would cost more than the GDP of the USA and would use up 300 years of battery production

 

[TechnicAl]

mig wælding førüm?

mig wælding førüm?

spoken like a true welshman..

 

[slim_boy_fat]

and Britain could end up like Norway.

You mean full of happy, good-looking people?

There's just too many of us on the planet!

I've been saying this for decades, what we need is a conventional World War III. Nothing quite boosts manufacturing and reconstruction and creates international debt [which has to be repaid] like a good 'fecht'. Not a popular viewpoint, though.........

 

[fizzy]

You mean full of happy, good-looking people?


I've been saying this for decades, what we need is a conventional World War III. Nothing quite boosts manufacturing and reconstruction and creates international debt [which has to be repaid] like a good 'fecht'. Not a popular viewpoint, though.........

Well according to the Scottish Reserve Bank WW3 will start when Scotland gets independence

 

[slim_boy_fat]

Well according to the Scottish Reserve Bank WW3 will start when Scotland gets independence

Don't go getting all political on us or you know what'll happen.......

Oh, and Nemo me impune lacessit

 

[Gareth J]

BBC Radio 4 - A Pyrotechnic History of Humanity, Fire

How the mastery of fire and the energy it released gave our ancestors intelligence

www.bbc.co.uk

An interesting documentary regarding our species' hunger for energy. And the resultant embrace of fossil fuels and the potential routes out.

Well worth a listen for a slightly wider view that encorperates more of our history and how we came to be addicted to energy.

 

[fizzy]

Don't go getting all political on us or you know what'll happen.......

Oh, and Nemo me impune lacessit

That's not political - unless you are Scottish of course

 

[fizzy]

BBC Radio 4 - A Pyrotechnic History of Humanity, Fire

How the mastery of fire and the energy it released gave our ancestors intelligence

www.bbc.co.uk

An interesting documentary regarding our species' hunger for energy. And the resultant embrace of fossil fuels and the potential routes out.

Well worth a listen for a slightly wider view that encorperates more of our history and how we came to be addicted to energy.

It seems to me most of the Greens don't actually want unlimited free clean energy even if it were available. They want everyone to cut back on things and go back to the "good" old days

 

[Stupoty]

Buy the screwfix ones, LAP. They have a 3 year warranty

they refused to change individual ones for me, said I had to return the whole box of 10. ????

Stu

 

[gaz1]

That's not political - unless you are Scottish of course

only when your poking that fire

but there is the welsh you could poke as well

 

[fizzy]

only when your poking that fire

but there is the welsh you could poke as well

Why would anyone want more politicians?
Guy Fawkes had the right idea

 

[fixerupper]

Doesn’t matter how much energy you save with led lightbulbs in your time on earth.

you’ve only got to look at every fast food place, office building, etc with the lights left on when no one is there.

that’s before you get onto power stations, steelworks, car manufacturers, heavy industry.

Your right ...near here in a town on the south coast of Crete , there is a big empty supermarket on the main road just outside the town... They built a new store in town about five years ago so moved out of the out of town shop .. the lights have been on day and night since then ...

 

[8ob]

"Climate change could easily cause that to shift and Britain could end up like Norway."

Right I'm buying one of these,

It it probably won't help matters though

It would make little to no difference, before man rampaged across the world forest fires would sweep across entire continents.

Bob

 

[Screwdriver]

The Earths climate and eco system has settled into a relatively calm equilibrium with the energy being pumped into it, the water cycle and the enormous power locked up in the atmosphere. It is a gigantic amount of energy the earth has to "dispose of" and over a gargantuan period of time, this enormous heat pump has huge ice covered poles and a vast reservoir of heat capacity locked up in the oceans.

Part of the mind bogglingly complex system relies on the reflectivity (albedo) and absorption (greenhouse effect) of the atmosphere. Recently CO2 levels have increased; measurably and demonstrably. Since "the greenhouse effect" is also a well known phenomena we are only left to wonder where all the CO2 has come from...

Well, that's you and me (plus a few billion others) dumping vast reserves of CO2 into the atmosphere as we consume energy derived from fossil fuels. There's not a LOT of CO2 in the grand scheme of things but the key issue is it is in excess of the amount of CO2 our Earths eco system has evolved to cope with.

Since the climate is itself a vastly complex entity, it is difficult to predict exactly what the response will be. The simple notion of "more green house gasses means gradual warming" is (I think!) uncontested. It is what happens when the system warms up that should be worrying. More extreme weather events (thunderstorms, cyclones, hurricanes, floods, droughts etc.) as the Earth system has to dispose of more energy built up in the previously steady state equilibrium - built up over 100's of thousands of years.

The only other thing I might suggest is to look at Mars which was previously an Earth like water planet and likewise Venus which has a runaway greenhouse effect. That shows us what the future may hold if we knock our planets climate system off of its delicately poised balance point.

I actually think it's too late. It has been a century since we gave the climate system a kick and we are only beginning to see the effects now as the enormous amounts of energy in the atmosphere and oceans slowly succumb to the gentle pressure to move away from its delicate equilibrium. So I suggest it would be at least another century before we see the results of a reduction in CO2. I'll be long gone before then, plus, I do like a well tuned two stroke...

 

[fizzy]

The Earths climate and eco system has settled into a relatively calm equilibrium with the energy being pumped into it, the water cycle and the enormous power locked up in the atmosphere. It is a gigantic amount of energy the earth has to "dispose of" and over a gargantuan period of time, this enormous heat pump has huge ice covered poles and a vast reservoir of heat capacity locked up in the oceans.

Part of the mind bogglingly complex system relies on the reflectivity (albedo) and absorption (greenhouse effect) of the atmosphere. Recently CO2 levels have increased; measurably and demonstrably. Since "the greenhouse effect" is also a well known phenomena we are only left to wonder where all the CO2 has come from...

Well, that's you and me (plus a few billion others) dumping vast reserves of CO2 into the atmosphere as we consume energy derived from fossil fuels. There's not a LOT of CO2 in the grand scheme of things but the key issue is it is in excess of the amount of CO2 our Earths eco system has evolved to cope with.

Since the climate is itself a vastly complex entity, it is difficult to predict exactly what the response will be. The simple notion of "more green house gasses means gradual warming" is (I think!) uncontested. It is what happens when the system warms up that should be worrying. More extreme weather events (thunderstorms, cyclones, hurricanes, floods, droughts etc.) as the Earth system has to dispose of more energy built up in the previously steady state equilibrium - built up over 100's of thousands of years.

The only other thing I might suggest is to look at Mars which was previously an Earth like water planet and likewise Venus which has a runaway greenhouse effect. That shows us what the future may hold if we knock our planets climate system off of its delicately poised balance point.

I actually think it's too late. It has been a century since we gave the climate system a kick and we are only beginning to see the effects now as the enormous amounts of energy in the atmosphere and oceans slowly succumb to the gentle pressure to move away from its delicate equilibrium. So I suggest it would be at least another century before we see the results of a reduction in CO2. I'll be long gone before then, plus, I do like a well tuned two stroke...

A long post but spot on.
Sadly climate deniers don't like proper science!
There is a current solution that would work and has been around since the 1950s but sadly isn't acceptable to many.
Hopefully fusion will finally take off. If it does CO2 scrubbers could be the answer. And no I don't mean for cleaning up power stations but to remove CO2 from the air. A reverse carbon cycle if you will. They could stick all the raw carbon back down the mines then

 

[Screwdriver]

A long post but spot on.
Sadly climate deniers don't like proper science!
There is a current solution that would work and has been around since the 1950s but sadly isn't acceptable to many.
Hopefully fusion will finally take off. If it does CO2 scrubbers could be the answer. And no I don't mean for cleaning up power stations but to remove CO2 from the air. A reverse carbon cycle if you will. They could stick all the raw carbon back down the mines then

That is the crux of the matter. Our planet has over the eons developed various methods for dissipating the vast quantities of energy we recieve from the Sun. CO2 is a part of that cycle and the eco system is delicately balanced to manage the natural byproduct of the CO2 the Earth naturally produces (yes, that includes the odd volcano...).

But over the past century or so, we have increased the amount of CO2 just over and above the amount the Earths climate system has evolved deal with. The best example is filling a bucket with water while there's a small hole in the bottom. At just the "perfect" equilibrium point, the water runs out just as fast as you fill it up. The level remains constant. Introduce even the tiniest bit more "flow" (CO2 in this analogy) and the bucket will ventually fill to the brim and overflow. It's a property known as "forcing" if you want to Google it.

What happens when the bucket fills up (global warming is the friendly face of that) is currently unknown. The climate will invariably change as the earth attempts to find a new balance point. Extreme weather here we come. It is quite possible we will live to see massive storms, I mean massive as in hundreds of miles per hour winds etc. Potentially the end of the Gulf Stream too which will be a disaster for the UK. Probably take decades or maybe centuries but the writing is on the wall.