remove broken 10mm cylinder head bolt with 5mm sticking up

[the snooper]

No I already stated I am trying to help the op.

I said a welded nut wouldn't work IN THIS CASE

You and others said it would now you are saying it wouldn't

So we agree

my last reply to you
you are not helping the op you are just arguing saying that a tried and tested method doesn't work, if that's helping then I'm glad your not trying to be unhelpful

 

[Parm]

In my view and speaking from over 50years of fitting turning and welding I can see no way any form of hand pressure gripping device is going to remove that stud so would be a complete waste of time and risks damage to the head.
It has been suggested welding a washer then a nut on top, this in my opinion has the greatest chance of success with the adition of raising the washer very slightly before welding so it doesn't bind and cause friction when undoing.
If the stud shears flush, I would drill it and to keep the drill central, if logistics allow, would replace the head then make and temper a steel bush that would slide in the stud hole and have a clearance hole for the pilot drill.

A proper engineering solution

 

[dannyp]

i've managed to get broken head studs of of volkswagen waterboxes, by welding nuts on them. in pritty much the same sort of situation ( and those engines are a pain for head studs snapping and known to be big problems getting them out )

quite often in my day job i'm removeing sheared studs and bolts, i would say it it the most effective economical way of getting a stubborn stud out. on meany occasions the welded on nut will take a lot more torque than was required to snap the stud, usally because it snaped on a flaw that corrosion has developed. with a good weld very rarely dose the weld give normaly as the tension was taken off when it snaped and the thermal shock means it just winds out with littel effort, but if needed it'll take the bar

also welding it will get it all red hot really quick, i think meany people forget just how littel thermal mass as stud / nut has in relation to the power in a welding arc. large bits of plate get hot without " that much " welding on them

best thing for the OP to do is put his location up as if this discussion goes on much longer i'll go and get it out if it's not that far away. otherwise get some scraps runa few beads to get used to your plant then mockup the situation and practice

 

[I'm getting on a bit]

this one shows the drilling to relieve the stud strength

and this one

Yes I agree these 3 would work they are steel bolts in thin steel we are arguing about 75mm in aluminium big difference.

 

[dannyp]

if your after an engineering solution or it's an expensive block. and welding the nut has failed

get some black flat usally 150 or 200 x 12 or 15 mark out all the cyl head bolt holes on it and drill them. grind the top of the stud flat and center pop. take your drilled plate and bolt it to the block, then remove whatever bolt stops you getting a mag drill on there. then use the mag drill to drill it out.

tho this will mean finding a company to sell you a lump of black flat and hireing or borrowing a mag drill

 

[normspanners]

thin steel

Wheel hubs thin steel ???
You wanted videos to prove that welding a nut to a stud would be strong enough I gave you three!!

Anyway I give up arguing, I will just carry on getting bolts out------ with a method that will not work (according to some)------ in my merry way!!

 

[I'm getting on a bit]

my last reply to you
you are not helping the op you are just arguing saying that a tried and tested method doesn't work, if that's helping then I'm glad your not trying to be unhelpful

No I am really trying to help.

This will be my last reply on a slightly different way of doing it

Drill the core of the stud for a tight fit on the smooth part of a suitable bolt

Using a drill driver with the clutch set weak
run the bolt as fast as possible to get a friction weld let it cool and then try removing it.

The heat should supply the thermal shock and the weak clutch will slip allowing the weld to hold until cooled

Goodbye

 

[MattH]

Yes I agree these 3 would work they are steel bolts in thin steel we are arguing about 75mm in aluminium big difference.

A couple of pages ago I posted pics of using this method. That was a steel stud in a Alu head and it works a treat. Yes not M10 and 75mm but a good comparison on stud width vs depth ratio. The stud had snapped. The welded on nut did not shear off and the stud wound out with ease.
It works, it's easy. Why the problem with belief?

 

[awemawson]

MANY years ago I had a stuck stud in the head of a Triumph Mayflower. Usual issue - aluminum head, steel stud, badly corroded as they do. No welding kit then

I made up a custom 'hole saw' by wrapping a piece of thin steel (20 thou shim stock if I remember correctly) round a similar stud, filed teeth in the end and drilled round the offending stud with this contraption. Had to re-file the teeth several times as it blunted quickly, but it worked.

 

[bobl]

I have updated my location and thank you for the suggestion.
If I had more stud I'd already have tried stud removers and just blobbing weld on because that would get the bolt hotter.
Maybe I should blob some weld on the top anyway just to get maximum heat into the bolt BEFORE welding the nut on.
I've only got 5 mm sticking up and, without trying it, doubt my ability to build a tower of weld up sufficient to grip.
Popping a nut/washer on would give me something of a container to work inside and I'm sure that striker plate idea would help.
BTW the bolt broke where it narrows into the threaded bit and I fear that drilling might produce another source of weakness that could cause another snap. I'm aware that drilling might weaken the bolt in a good way but if it snaps I'm worse off.
I have called a professional welder and left a message asking for a price.
I might be able to borrow an arc welder with more current....won't know until after 9.00
Back soon.

 

[steveo3002]

worst case buy a used mig from ebay and re sell it once youre done , should get similar money back so would work out cheap

 

[bobl]

That's certainly an option.
Welding is something that has always fascinated me i.e.
Years ago I did a course with a class 1 pressure vessel welder and my Rover 60 exhaust went.
I held the welding gear and my friend held my arms.
The result was amazingly good and I remember thinking my own movements would have been very different to his, no doubt with commensurately different results

 

[Chris Stevens]

Dont even try it with a cheap arc welder, unless you have years of experience and know exactly what you are doing. Either find someone with a 200amp MIG to build the broken part up so you can grip it, or dont bother with welding and drill it out. You will need something like a 5mm carbide drill for pilot hole, then 8.5mm masonry drill (sharpen end so cutting edges are more like metal cutting drill). Its important to keep the drilled hole concentric to broken bolt, so might be worth getting a drill bush made if you arent very good at drilling? When the bolt broke, had you tried hammering the head, to try and break the hold of the rust? Sometimes works and is always worth a try.

 

[God mode restorations]

A very interesting debate this is...the things is this.most of us have done this sort of thing numerous amounts of times with success. .as we all know that broken studs/bolts can be notoriously difficult at times to remove even for the experienced. There is great knowledge and idears from all of us to help this chap out...if the op has limited tooling at hand then the problem becomes twice as difficult. ..I think sometimes we forget that most of us has welding equipment and the necessary tools to perform the task.my suggestion would be if the op has not got got the kit then it might be worth taking it to an engineering company who can do the task at hand.other wise you will do more damage than good..not having a dig.just a suggestion. ...

 

[bobl]

No I hadn't hammered the bolts down BEFORE trying to undo them but really wish I had i.e. a mechanic friend and an engineer friend both suggested that that's what I should have done....I agree.
Chris I can't argue with your logic at all.

___if the op has limited tooling at hand then the problem becomes twice as difficult
You're not joking...and I'm doing nothing until I'm very clear re the best way forward.
Not normally my MO but the hassle of getting this wrong was sufficient to make me pause as evidenced by this thread.

___it might be worth taking it to an engineering company
That means towing my car....or taking the block off

 

[steveo3002]

you could search mobile thread repair etc for you area , theres guys that travel around garages sorting things like that and fitting thread inserts etc...prob cost the same as a used welder

 

[bobl]

Thanks.

 

[Chris Stevens]

There is an old boy in my area who has been doing thread repairs for years, and finding someone like that close to you, would probably be your best option.

 

[rusty weld]

A very interesting debate this is...the things is this.most of us have done this sort of thing numerous amounts of times with success. .as we all know that broken studs/bolts can be notoriously difficult at times to remove even for the experienced. There is great knowledge and idears from all of us to help this chap out...if the op has limited tooling at hand then the problem becomes twice as difficult. ..I think sometimes we forget that most of us has welding equipment and the necessary tools to perform the task.my suggestion would be if the op has not got got the kit then it might be worth taking it to an engineering company who can do the task at hand.other wise you will do more damage than good..not having a dig.just a suggestion. ...

We all have to start somewhere but having read the op posts and given the consequences of c0cking it up I believe this project is not the place to start without an expert on hand.

 

[steveo3002]

at least he hasnt snapped an easy out in it